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23-06-2016 - Referendum on UK Membership in European Union
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dai



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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 7:57 pm    Post subject: 23-06-2016 - Referendum on UK Membership in European Union Reply with quote

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_European_Union_membership_referendum,_2016

Perhaps you all know where I say I stand on Ersatz Israel ... with my Right Foot on Mount Gerizim ( " blessing those who keep The Law " ) and my Left Foot on Mount Ebal ( " cursing those who break The Law " ) ... and from my point of view the sole reason why the supporters of The United Kingdom do not want to have The European Court interfering in their affairs is that their conduct is corrupt and they want them to continue it be so : The United Kingdom remains true to the nature of its origins in The Age of Privateering in the 17c ... When simply every sort of Ultraist - Hierocrats, Democrats, Aristocrats as well as The Monocrats - agreed that licencing criminality was a jolly rogered thing - as was what then grew out of ransoming captives, which was The Slave Trade which of course was argued to be fundamentally beneficial for all of those involved ... even those thrown over board were benefiting from a Hierocratic sort of burial and the insurance policies paid out in a very Democratic fashion thus furnishing very Aristocratic profits to pay very Monocratic taxes ... Everything of course justified by Thomas Hobbes' " Sovereignty " which was mentioned in the second episode of this which addresses the who issue of borders ... traveling ... and having a sense of " Nationality." ... ( Instead of being so disconnected from those you live with - and sharing nothing with others that could truly create a sense of belonging to a community - that you opt into being " British." )

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b077rxbt - BORDERS : AN ODYSSEY - ( Episode 2 ) - THE JOURNEY

Is home just a story we tell ourselves? This three-part series continues with Frances Stonor Saunders following Homer's Odysseus, the mythical avatar of all our journeys, as he struggles to get home and asks how much home we really need.

With Judith Kerr, Helen Sharman, Misha Glenny, Neal Ascherson, David Willetts, Edith Hall. Readings by Sam West. Producer: Fiona Leach. Researcher: Ruth Edwards.


Shortly after that programme there was another which declared that statistically the overwhelming majority of scientists are theoretically opposed to " BRExit " on the basis of the present evidence - although this of course will be re-assessed in the light of any future experimental data and new opportunities to apply for government funding ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0770qv7 - EU membership and UK science, Quantum games, Fixing genes

The UK science community draws vital benefits from EU membership and could lose influence in the event of an exit, says a House of Lords report out this week.
UK researchers placed a high value on collaboration opportunities afforded by EU membership. ... A number also believe the UK would lose its ability to influence EU science policy in the event of leaving - something that's disputed by pro-Brexit campaigners. ...


Nearly everybody contributing to the " IN/OUT " debate are talking in terms of temporary short terms gains - usually economic - without any political conception - and less economic understanding of how future political developments may result in The United Kingdom disadvantaging both manufacturing for export and commercial trading for import. Referendums are good for deciding which national anthem to sing or what colour dress The Queen ought to wear this year, but they are lousy for complicated decisions if they are conducted in the way that all of the non-politics is conducted by the supporters of The Untied Kingdom - badly ! ... But David Cameron was loosing votes to UKIP so he promised a referendum, believing that he could brow-beat The Raving Righties in The Conservative & Unionist Party into standing in line ... but he was wrong : I think that The People in England are going to Vote Against The Funny Foreigners - and The People in Wales and The People in Scotland ... and then wake up the following day only to be terribly disappointed to find out that David Cameron has no plan to cram all of us horrible Europeans into leaky boats and send us all off to live there since we all like Europe so much ... Come to think of it though - since The British Empire was and still is English, and most of it is still outside of Europe - why not offer everyone who still says that they do not want to live in Europe an assisted passage out of Eng-ER-land after the referendum ?

( But who would take them ? )
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dai



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PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2016 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know that I should be writing about this - especially because so many lies have already been exposed in the claims made by both pro- and con- campaigners which provide an object lesson in why Democracy should be seen as a crime and not a political system - but there are trailers running for the following in which the non-issue of " Sovereignty " is going to be argued over ... so let us all please remember - the modern notion of " Sovereignty " as used by the apologists for and supporters of The United Kingdom was re-invented in 1651 - it is the mythological idea devised by Thomas Hobbes to explain why a state needs a tyrant to enforce its laws against The People Who Are Nasty Brutish And Short - and so he clearly had in mind The People in Wales and The World ... and probably The People in Paris especially who put him in such a bad temper whilst he was in exile there that he stayed in his room and wrote " Leviathan " - and thus provided Oliver Cromwell with a very thin excuse to overthrow The Rule of Law and turn The Republic in Wales, England, Scotland and Ireland - and Rock All besides - into his private fief as The Protectorate ... and like Descartes' speculations, this is yet another example of the last gasp of Renaissance Republicanism ( c1450 - 1650 ) which used and / or adapted theology as the basis of its political arguments : Locke, Spinoza et al were already introducing what were to become the many philosophical arguments of Neo-Classical Republicanism ( c1650 - 1850 ) which many of The People in Wales and The World take to be Republicanism, being unaware that the arguments for Modern Republicanism ( c1850 - 2050 ? ) were also beginning to gestate and emerge in their antagonistic pairs - Conservativism V Anarchism c1790 - Liberalism V Socialism c1820 - Fascism V Communism c1850 ... but why are The People in Wales Unaware That Our Nation Was At The Centre Of All Of These Arguments For Over Five Hundred Years ?

Because The History in Wales is written by The People Who Assume That The Welsh Nation Has No History of Political Philosophy Besides A Bit Of Rioting By Ignorant Idiots.

Which is wrong - The People in Wales always philosophised politically because they had no political institutions left : but as soon as we acquired Y Prifysgol we " acquired " a record of our political philosophical debates - because somebody bothered to finally start gathering up what was being written and ( more importantly ) collecting the remains of what had been written ... which demonstrate that Republicanism in Wales began c1550 - or even earlier - with William Thomas, who was tutor to Edward VI and the very first to translate Machiavelli ... Mary I had him tried and executed for treason on false evidence - he was fitted up by The Police in South Wales I reckon ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leviathan ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leviathan_%28book%29

HEREIN IS PART OF THE REPUBLICAN OBJECTION TO " SOVEREIGNTY " -
" ... Hobbes describes human psychology without any reference to the summum bonum, or greatest good, as previous thought had done. Not only is the concept of a summum bonum superfluous, but given the variability of human desires, there could be no such thing. ... There is, however, Hobbes states, a summum malum, or greatest evil. This is the fear of violent death. A political community can be oriented around this fear. ... " - IN OTHER WORDS : A STATE FOUNDED UPON " SOVEREIGNTY " IS A TERRORIST STATE - IN " LEVIATHAN " HOBBES REJECTED THE IDEA OF THE PUBLIC INTEREST : HE WAS WRITING IN OPPOSITION TO THE NEW REPUBLICAN GOVERNMENT - AND HIS IDEA OF " SOVEREIGNTY " WAS USED BY CHARLES II TO OVERTHROW THE REPUBLIC AFTER THE PROTECTORATE FELL IN 1659 - AND USED AGAIN WHEN JAMES II WAS OVERTHROWN IN FAVOUR OF WILLIAM OF ORANGE ... THE UNITED KINGDOM AS FROM 1688 WAS FIRMLY FOUNDED UPON HOBBES' IDEA OF " SOVEREIGNTY " - 1688 WAS THE IN-GLORIOUS COUNTER-REVOLUTION !


http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07c6n58 - PAXMAN IN BRUSSELS - WHO REALLY RULES US ? - 20.00 pm - Thursday - 19-05-16

As the EU referendum debate approaches its climax, Jeremy Paxman takes viewers on a journey to the heart of Europe, meeting the movers, shakers and anonymous faces who run the EU. His central question is simple - has the UK given the power to rule it to Europe, and if so, does it matter?

Meeting crucial figures like Michael Gove and Nick Clegg, he hears arguments on both sides, whilst also trying to understand just how the incredibly complex organisation operates. On his journey he struggles through the Parlamentarium (an EU museum that tries to explain the place), tries on a replica of Margaret Thatcher's famous EU jumper and samples the EU-regulated wares of the Portobello Road.


... oh ... oh dear ... perhaps this is not going to be worth watching after all ... it looks like another waste of my licence money ... what did early critics call television - a fools' lantern ?


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dai



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PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2016 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leviathan_%28book%29 ...

Well I mentioned Hobbes' book " Leviathan " above - infamous for most Republicans but most Republicans are aware of it - but most Republicans are not aware of " Behemoth " which was his next best-seller ... or would have been had he not been hoist by his own petard in " Leviathan " by his argument therein that - " ... because the purpose of the commonwealth is peace, and the sovereign has the right to do whatever he thinks necessary for the preserving of peace and security and prevention of discord. Therefore, the sovereign may judge what opinions and doctrines are averse, who shall be allowed to speak to multitudes, and who shall examine the doctrines of all books before they are published." ... oops ... of course Hobbes could have published " Behemoth " and be damned ... and he would have been - because he had created The King as Sovereign and possessed of the sole right - " to prescribe the rules of civil law and property." ... and ... " to be judge in all cases. " ... and ... " the sovereign cannot injure any of his subjects and cannot be accused of injustice." ... " the sovereign exists because the majority has consented to his rule; the minority have agreed to abide by this arrangement and must then assent to the sovereign's actions." ... " because the covenant forming the commonwealth results from subjects giving to the sovereign the right to act for them, the sovereign cannot possibly breach the covenant; and therefore the subjects can never argue to be freed from the covenant because of the actions of the sovereign." ... " because a successive covenant cannot override a prior one, the subjects cannot ( lawfully ) change the form of government." ... " the sovereign cannot justly be put to death by the subjects." ... yet The King as Sovereign is possessed of the sole right - " to make war and peace as he sees fit and to command the army." ... " to establish laws about honour and a scale of worth." ... " to choose counsellors, ministers, magistrates and officers." ... " to reward with riches and honour or to punish with corporal or pecuniary punishment or ignominy." ... and " Sovereignty " is now supposedly exercised by " The Crown in Parliament " but in reality is in the hands of The Prime Minister of The United Kingdom - who is selected by those with the money to buy The Democratic Party in Wales and Westminster of their choice and appoint its leader and pay for it to be elected by the means that we are now witnessing being deployed in the recent Welsh Assembly election, The Mayor in London election - and now in The Referendum on The European Union ... and you thought that The European Parliament was a bad thing ? ... It is absolutely not as bad as The United Kingdom - but the reason that you do not know that is because you have never been told before what The Constitution of The United Kingdom looks like - because there is not one : The Democrats in Wales and Westminster desperately do not want you to know what they are up to and will not provide you with any means to hold them to account - which is why they are desperate to get away from the threatening jurisdiction of The European Courts - through which we can challenge their non-principle of " Sovereignty " and obtain justice against them - understand it now ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behemoth_%28Hobbes_book%29 ... http://sites.cardiff.ac.uk/politics/profile/2673/

" Behemoth, full title Behemoth: the history of the causes of the civil wars of England, and of the counsels and artifices by which they were carried on from the year 1640 to the year 1660, also known as The Long Parliament, is a book written by Thomas Hobbes discussing the English Civil War. Published posthumously in 1681, it was written in 1668, but remained unpublished at the request of Charles II of England. ... Behemoth was written in 1668 as a follow-up to a previous and scandalous political work, Leviathan (1651). Leviathan is a representation of an ideal political world, and Behemoth has been considered to be a contrasting treatise on what happens when the very worst abuses of government come to pass. ... The book is written in the form of a discourse between two men. ... an eyewitness and ... a student aiming to understand the breakdown in the government of England at that time. ... The dialogue opens with the student asking the master how it was that a monarch as strong as Charles I should ever have had to face a rebellion. The master relates that a growing opposition to the crown was promoted by seven factions, each of them for their own ends and not in concert, who stoked the fires of rebellion. ... Hobbes reminds his student that obedience is all that is required to live a good and peaceful life. ... When this directive for disobedience was coupled with the teachings of ancient rebellions as a way to remove so called despotic domains it left a fertile ground for revolution in England. ... "

" Behemoth " is perhaps of interest to The Republicans in Wales for a reason beyond its contents : our local hero Howard Williams, a Professor of Various Bits of Y Prifysgol Cymru - who amongst other things writes about Ideology, which is a subject of universal interest to The Republicans in The World - has written a study comparing the merits of the conceptuaisation of " revolution " as discussed by Hobbes and Kant. [ NEITHER BEING THE CONCEPT WHICH I FAVOUR ]


" ... Immanuel Kant, one of the leading intellects of the Age of Enlightenment, had a different view on the nature of rebellions from Hobbes. ... Hobbes did not believe that anything positive came out of the civil war. ... Kant, according to Williams, shares the same basic attitude to the resistance of sovereign power but does not think that all outcomes of Rebellion are necessarily negative. ... Going further Kant, according to Williams, implies that uprisings are the wrong solution to a problem with governance but that there can still be something positive in the results of that uprising. ... Hobbes does not think that there is any sort of innate morality in society and that rebellion is either " an unwise or failed experiment as a complete blunder arising from ignorance." ... Hobbes was deeply affected by the Civil war and believed that rebellion would not be a solution. Instead " only an absolute sovereign power could teach ' the science of just and unjust,' fixing meanings in a stable way and thus inducing social cohesion " ... Hobbes then is a supporter of an "absolute sovereignty, embodied in a monarch or corporate body of individuals; " Kant is a supporter of popular sovereignty, embodied in the law-making powers of a group of the people's representatives. ... Another key difference between the two philosophers is the way that the laws of the land should be administered. An absolute monarch, for Hobbes, implies that the authority of that monarch "must be beyond question, whereas for Kant the sovereign's authority is best safeguarded through the possibility of public debate and criticism. ... "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_philosophy_of_Immanuel_Kant

" ... The political philosophy of Immanuel Kant (1724–1804) favoured a classical republican approach. In Perpetual Peace: A Philosophical Sketch (1795), Kant listed several conditions that he thought necessary for ending wars and creating a lasting peace. They included a world of constitutional republics by establishment of political community. His classical republican theory was extended in Doctrine of Right (1797), the first part of Metaphysics of Morals. At the end of the 20th century Kant's political philosophy had been enjoying a remarkable renaissance in English-speaking countries with more major studies in a few years than had appeared in the preceding many decades ... Kant's most significant contribution to political philosophy and the philosophy of law is the doctrine of Rechtsstaat. According to this doctrine, the power of the state is limited in order to protect citizens from the arbitrary exercise of authority. The Rechtsstaat ( German: Rechtsstaat ) is a concept in continental European legal thinking, originally borrowed from German jurisprudence, which can be translated as "the Legal state" or "state of rights". It is a "constitutional state" in which the exercise of governmental power is constrained by the law, and is often tied to the Anglo-American concept of the rule of law. Kant's political philosophy has been described as liberal for its presumption of limits on the state based on the social contract as a regulative matter. ... " ... [ - HERE IN THE DIS-UNITED KINGDOM " THE SOCIAL CONTRACT " WAS FINALLY DESTROYED BY THE DEMOCRATS IN WESTMINSTER USING THE ELECTORAL REGISTRATION AND ADMINISTRATION ACT 2013 TO STEAL OUR NAMES TO " SIGN " THEIR ANTI-SOCIAL CONTRACT - WHICH IS MORE OR LESS LIKE PLAYING WITH MATCHES IN A MINE FULL OF FIRE-DAMP HERE IN WALES ... ]

http://cms-content.bates.edu/prebuilt/justice.pdf

CHAPTER NINE ( - OF WHAT ? )

JUSTICE AND REVOLUTION IN KANT’S POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY - DAVID CUMMISKEY


" ... Kant maintained that the enthusiasm experienced by the spectators of the French Revolution constituted evidence of the fundamental moral disposition in human nature. Nonetheless, an absolute prohibition on revolution is at the very heart of Kant’s Doctrine of Right in his The Metaphysics of Morals (MM). Kant’s opposition to even progressive revolutions is clearly puzzling ... his opposition to the right of revolution was no mere passing opinion. It appears in all of his major discussions of justice and Kant sticks to his position even in responding to a critic challenging the consistency of his position. One would thus expect Kant to have good, if not sound, grounds for his conclusion. ... we see that the prohibition on revolution is part of a general prohibition on the individual use of coercive means to promote individual ends. ... when state power is systematically used to exclude some for the benefit of others then it is simply Lawless organized power. In such a case, morally speaking, we are confronted with an unjust state of war, not a civil society. ... " ... mmm ... David Cumminsky's analysis does go on a bit ... I am not so sure that I think that Kant was thinking that ... genuine Republican stuff though ... so easy to philosophise about when you are not anticipating that your own home will end up as a charred shell ... try philosophising with a violent mob first before you try this !

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3391297/PETER-OSBORNE-Labour-MPs-handed-knife-assassinate-Corbyn.html

I think that it is worth repeating here the advice regularly given out on Blue Peter : if your political project involves any risk of injury to yourself - ask your mother-in-law to do it ...
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dai



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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those who obey the laws of the state_In disobedience to God and prate_About The Sovereignty of The King_Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_To justify injustice you can not legislate ! = dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !

THE MISTAKES THAT THOMAS HOBBES MAKES ...

Those who obey the laws of the state_
In disobedience to God and prate_
About The Sovereignty of The King_
Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_
To justify injustice you can not legislate !

=

dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !


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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those who obey the laws of the state_In disobedience to God and prate_About The Sovereignty of The King_Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_To justify injustice you can not legislate ! = dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !

THE MISTAKES THAT THOMAS HOBBES MAKES ...

Those who obey the laws of the state_
In disobedience to God and prate_
About The Sovereignty of The King_
Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_
To justify injustice you can not legislate !

=

dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !


Last edited by dai on Mon May 16, 2016 6:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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dai



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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those who obey the laws of the state_In disobedience to God and prate_About The Sovereignty of The King_Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_To justify injustice you can not legislate ! = dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !

THE MISTAKES THAT THOMAS HOBBES MAKES ...

Those who obey the laws of the state_
In disobedience to God and prate_
About The Sovereignty of The King_
Have sold their souls - for here is the thing :_
To justify injustice you can not legislate !

=

dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence : the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !


Last edited by dai on Mon May 16, 2016 6:55 am; edited 1 time in total
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dai



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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2016 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These multiple posts have been happening all weekend and I thought that it was an operating system fault - but this is from another computer. A surveillance bug stuck in the phpBB file perhaps ? Typical Brit-shit ? ... I wish the CIA would do this surveillance thing on behalf of GGCHQ etc - not only would they conduct it more competently but they would recognise that my political stance is an entirely normal form of conventional Republican argumentation - I am nothing like Donald Trump !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36300005

Come to think of it - I was copying over proems into emails and multiple copies of those were arriving too : look guys - this is The Open Conspiracy ( there is no conspiracy - What You See Is What You've Got : change the political system - or rather : end this non-political system by giving us a real political system.)
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dai



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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2016 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well ... I guess things are waming up now : what a gift this European Union Membership Referendum is proving to be for a Pure Republican critique of the non-political system of Democracy.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36306681 - [b]Nigel Farage: Narrow Remain win may lead to second referendum


" There could be unstoppable demand for a re-run of the EU referendum if Remain wins by a narrow margin on 23 June, UKIP leader Nigel Farage has said. ... Number 10 said Mr Farage's comments showed he was losing the argument and was no longer confident of winning. ... There are less than six weeks until voters go to the polls to decide whether they want the UK to stay in or leave the European Union. ... Mr Farage said he was not admitting defeat in the referendum, saying: "I think we are going to win." ...

... As the Leave and Remain camps continue to exchange fire on the twin issues of the economy and security, the tone of the campaign has attracted growing criticism. ... Boris Johnson has been accused of "political amnesia" after he suggested the EU's objective of creating a "single authority" in Europe had historical parallels with Adolf Hitler in the 1930s. ... "Such absurd arguments should be completely ignored if they had not been formulated by one of the most influential politicians of the ruling party," said Donald Tusk, president of the European Council. ... "Boris Johnson crossed the boundaries of a rational discourse. Today we have to finally begin to remind ourselves of this banal and perhaps boring truth: the only alternative for the Union is political chaos." ... The PM [ DAVID CAMEON ] said in a speech on Monday morning it was worth asking "who would be happy if we left" the EU, and added: "Putin might be happy, I suspect Al Baghdadi might be happy." ... Mr Johnson said it was "a bit much" to compare people "arguing for freedom in this country, or the restoration of democracy in this country, to say our allies are Putin and Daesh (IS)". ... "[/b]

... THE FACT IS THAT THE NON-POLITICAL SYSTEM WHICH IS NOT CALLED BY ITS SUPPORTERS " THE DIS-UNITED KINGDOM " IS NOW DISPLAYING ITS BARBARISM ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-36313027 - Severed human head found in Cambridgeshire quarry - The Democrat's wife failed to notice any difference !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-36309777 - Cases of "mate crime" - where vulnerable people are befriended then bullied or conned - are increasing, according to victim support workers dealing with the consequences of Democracy.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-36292742 - The political circus refused to apologise for its clowns after many were knocked out by a new stunt - Genny Flux, 37, from Whitewood, Caerphilly country, was taken to hospital after a backflip attempt by Carwyn the clown misfired ... Genny Flux met Carwyn the Clown in Cardiff on Friday night after being given free tickets to the show there ... Carwyn the Clown said it was an "unfortunate accident and it shouldn't have happened". ... Other clowns involved observed that " It was obviously a panicked response from somebody who didn't know what they were doing". ... Adam the Clown advised that children should never juggle with chainsaws but The Ghost Clown said that it was all those pesky kids' fault - they should never have voted for him ... Ronald Mac Donald feigned that he was unable to make any comment because he had aready been cautioned by his lawyers that they would sack him if he made any unpopular comments ... " Hey - hEy - heY - KIDS !!! - JUST KEEP ON SENDING US YOUR BLANK CHEQUES !!! " said Krusty the Clown wheras Shakes the Clown languidly poured herself a drink whilst Jack Point was furtively plunging his hands deep into his pockets but - SLAP ! - Arlechinno then laid about them all in The True Republican manner whilst singing " SEND OUT THE CLOWNS ! "

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgC2328r4lA

- more entertaining than -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTMxfAkxfQ0
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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2016 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now why should I find fault with them - ad infinitum -_( The Democrats in Wales I mean ) whenever I do sight them ?_There is no need to always do this_Because sometimes they'll do it for free ( not gratis ! )_For example : all of them have lied in this E.U. Referendum ... = Each and every Democrat compares themselves to God_Especially when they get to sit upon the firing squad_And to convict all of these vile Republicans ( whom they've never actually met )_By charging us with dishonouring them with our every epithet -_But we deny all of their charges - whilst they rush to fall upon our words ... = I met with Rhodri Morgan on the Cwrt-yr-Ala Road_As he greeted those ahead of me as if beneath a load :_Once he had set his eyes upon me he swiftly looked away_And mumbled then his greeting as if as much to say_" Get thee behind me - Repwblican ! " and his face was blue as woad ... = dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence - the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !

Now why should I find fault with them - ad infinitum -_
( The Democrats in Wales I mean ) whenever I do sight them ?_
There is no need to always do this_
Because sometimes they'll do it for free ( not gratis ! )_
For example : all of them have lied in this E.U. Referendum ...

=

Each and every Democrat compares themselves to God_
Especially when they get to sit upon the firing squad_
And to convict all of these vile Republicans ( whom they've never actually met )_
By charging us with dishonouring them with our every epithet -_
But we deny all of their charges - whilst they rush to fall upon our words ...

=

I met with Rhodri Morgan on the Cwrt-yr-Ala Road_
As he greeted those ahead of me as if beneath a load :_
Once he had set his eyes upon me he swiftly looked away_
And mumbled then his greeting as if as much to say_
" Get thee behind me - Repwblican ! " and his face was blue as woad ... as woe'd ... (?)
=

dai repwblic = Dai Saw = David B Lawrence - the author asserts the moral right - not to sue for copyright !


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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2016 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregory_Benford#Benford.27s_law_of_controversy

' Benford's Law '

" Passion is inversely proportional to the amount of real information available."


Gregory Benford is a Professor Emeritus at the University of California, Irvine, where he was a Professor of Physics. ...


... There is a tendency to think that things might be better elsewhere, that in The United States of America they mastered Democracy long ago and that by copying their constitutional laws we can not go far wrong ... now please remember that here in Wales I am not using the terms " Democrat " and " Republican " in their modern 21c American sense but in a sense which closely parallels the sense given to those terms in the 1770s. In brief - a " Demockerat " is somebody who thinks that Democracy is a political system and that the collective creation of De Re Publica amounts somehow to the result of the collective pursuit of self-interest i.e. that " politics " consists of the pursuit of power by all " legitimate " means, which means that once power has been obtained the means by which it has been obtained is made legitimate for the those who have power and not legitimate for those who do not have power e.g. international corporations fund various Democrats upon the condition that they do not create laws which impose taxation upon their companies - but they do create laws which impose sanctions upon their employees for asking for living wages and whistle-blowing about those companies' harmful activities. " Pure Republicans " dismiss idea that there are " Left Wing " or " Right Wing " Democrats - they are all " Off Centre " and pursuing their own self-interests in elections, hence they are deliberately cultivating sectarian divisions in their society in order to surf to victory upon a tidal wave of ballots won through various kinds of deception ranging from not merely misdirection and misinformation but also downright barefaced lies ... and therefore the practices of The Democrats in Wales and The World are not compatible with The Public Interest - De Re Publica - and therefore Democracy itself is against our Welsh/World Political Society ( W/WPS ! ) ... you may of course disagree with such a point of view, but you will find it difficult to refute without first having to explain away all of the evidence ...

SO MANY LIES - AND SO LITTLE TIME ... THIS ALL STARTED HUNDREDS THOUSANDS OF YEAR AGO, WHEN SOME RENEGADE DRUID FIRST CANVASSED THE INEXPERIENCED FIRST ELECTOR

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2016/may/16/lies-damned-lies-and-brexit-statistics

Lies, damned lies, and Brexit statistics - Martin Belam - 16-05-16 - The Guardian


Investigating a Leave.EU claim that non-EU members are more successful at Eurovision shows just how easy it is for both sides in the EU referendum debate to manipulate figures to make their case ... Both sides of the EU referendum campaign are bombarding us with charts, facts and numbers, intending to convince us of their arguments. But we all know the famous adage “Well, you can prove anything with facts.” ... [ UH ? NO - YOU CAN NOT PROVE ANYTHING WITH FACTS : PROOFS ARE MADE WITH ARGUMENTS NOT FACTS.] ... Looking at a rather frivilous claim last week gives us some insight into just how easy it is to twist even a small set of figures to make the case for and against Brexit. ...


http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-04-06/farage-government-pro-eu-leaflet-jammed-full-of-lies/

" .... Boris Johnson said it was "crazy" to use so much taxpayers' money on a "very biased and hysterical" campaign about the risks of leaving the EU. ... The Government's pro-EU leaflet is "jammed full of lies", Nigel Farage has said. ... "This is very much like what happened in 1975, legally it is questionable and morally it is wrong. It was wrong in 1975 and it is wrong now. .... "This Government scam confirms my view that this referendum will be defined by the battle of the people versus the political class. ... Last updated Fri 15 Apr 2016 ... "

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/673064/David-Cameron-Ukip-EU-referendum-membership-Turke-lying-Farage

" ...In an impassioned message to voters the Ukip leader put immigration at the heart of the referendum debate saying it was “not about economic, it is about politics". ... Dagenham on the border between East London and Essex was chosen specifically because it has the biggest immigration problem in the UK ... He added that there was also “a cultural problem" and warned about the effects of schools having pupils where up to 80 per cent do not speak English. ... [ E.G. IN NORTH WALES ? ] ... And branding his passport he said it was “the most potent symbol" of the campaign, pointing out that “the first two words are European Union." ... He said: “508 million people have one of these and they can all come to this country." .... "

[ 48.5 MILLION PASSPORTS IN THE UK ~ 0.25 MILLION LOST / STOLEN PER YEAR ? ] https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/118666/23565-passport-ownership.pdf


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/118666/23565-passport-ownership.pdf

" ... David Cameron suggested that voting for Brexit was immoral, Christopher Hope and Ben Riley-Smith report. ... The Prime Minister faced a backlash from members of his own Government, including threats of resignations, after he gave warning that leaving the European Union would be the “self-destruct option” for Britain, and that the “moral case” at the referendum was to stay in the EU. ... The report was criticised by leading Tory Eurosceptics such as Boris Johnson, who said it was a “hoax”, and the former Cabinet minister Iain Duncan Smith, who said it was “not an honest assessment but a deeply biased view of the future”. ... rumours swept Westminster that two members of the Government – a junior minister and a ministerial aide – were threatening to resign in protest. ... Mr Johnson, the former mayor of London, said during a tour of Yorkshire that there was a danger the pair’s “scaremongering” could itself help plunge the economy into recession. ... He said the warnings were “totally made up” and there was “no evidence whatsoever” the economy would fall into recession if the country left the EU. ... Responding to the report Boris Johnson accused the government of putting out more "propaganda than we have seen" at any time since 1992. ... " .... [ ... ONLY 1992 ???? ]


http://eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=85934 .... [ DATED 20-02-16 ] ... EU Referendum: papering over the lies
Richard North


" So, Mr Cameron says he has secured a "special status" for Britain within a reformed EU. He has done no such thing. His deal pretends to be legally biding but it is not. ... He has cobbled together a pretend treaty combining a mish-mash of aspirations and political declarations, with no legal force whatsoever. Those parts which promise substantive change are dependent on treaty change at some unspecified point in the future, with no guarantees that they can be delivered. ... the ultimate confidence trick. ... simply re-cooked a 22-year-old provision ... The "red card" is nothing but a hollow joke ... He was tied to a promise he could not deliver. ... the Prime Minister has sought to conceal from the British public this brutal truth, culminating in last Friday's charade when he pretended to have negotiated a "special status" which isn't worth the paper it's printed on. ... this piece of paper is nothing but a fraud – a pretence. ... the basis for a referendum where he is intent on selling his snake-oil "special status". ... Our prospects sitting uneasily on the margins of the emerging superstate will not be promising. Unloved, ignored and marginalised, we face an uncertain, even risky future, on the outskirts of the new European empire. ... This is why, on 23 June, we have to vote to leave the EU. To buy into Mr Cameron's pretence is to give him and successive politicians a license to lie. If as a people, we accept this garbage, we will take anything – and deserve what we get. ... "

THAT BLOG HAS SOME INTERESTING POINTS OF VIEW - AND RICHARD NORTH WROTE THIS - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Many-Not-Few-Richard-North/dp/1441131515?ie=UTF8&qid=1319297545&ref_=sr_1_1&s=books&sr=1-1

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/23/vote-leave-campaign-fear-brexit-referendum

Vote Leave’s campaign of fear will cause lasting divisions - Polly Toynbee - 23-05-16

The xenophobic lies of Brexit supporters can only fuel resentment, whatever the referendum outcome

" ... Four weeks to go, can it get any worse? Yes, it really can, as there seems no depth to which the out campaign will not sink. Who would predict that urbane “modern” Conservatives would plunge so fast into a Powellite gutter of racism that has not been seen in Westminster for decades? ... Frantic, reckless, ruthless, the leavers have nowhere to turn but xenophobia, trounced by the tsunami of warnings of a Brexit ... But Gove and Johnson treat facts with Trump-scale disdain. Instead, reaching into dark-hearted fear, they claim Turks, Albanians, Macedonians, Serbs and Montenegrins are poised to invade. ... As defence minister (good grief, she really is), Penny Mordaunt lied boldly on Sunday: “I don’t think the UK can stop Turkey joining.” Oh, yes we can, and so can the Poles, Hungarians, Austrians and other increasingly migrant-phobic countries the Vote Leavers urge us to resemble. ... It really doesn’t matter that it isn’t true. For their campaign, facts get in the way – they are contemptuously judging that their supporters won’t know the difference. Besides, the likes of Iain Duncan Smith have form on ignoring evidence, repeating untruths about migrants on benefits despite rebukes from the UK Statistics Authority. ... " [ I HAVE TO CURB MY ENTHUSIASM THERE - GO READ A GOOD WRITER ! ... BUT, OH - YES ! ... ] ... Anti-elite, anti-politics sentiment is fertile soil for those with fallen wages, good jobs swapped for Uber zero-hours insecurity, while inequality removes the professional classes yet further from the lower half. An inchoate, unpoliticised resentment can easily be redirected against outsiders, instead of the real perpetrators. ... "
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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2016 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NOW THIS MATHS WILL CHEER YOU UP A LOT DAF =

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trivialism - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trivia

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trivia


= HOW ABOUT A CONTEST TO USE PRO & CON TRIVIA TO ANALYSE THE EU REPERENDUM ?
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2016 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=elaxY4iufok
https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=DvNbglGKBeY
https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=k8pcP8c5tUQ = YNG NGHYMRAEG POLSKI - ¿?


Yr Undeb Rhwngwladol

Deffrowch, orthrymedigion daear,
Cyfodi mae'r newynog lu
Daw gwirioneddau'r bywyd newydd
I chwalu niwl yr oesoedd fu.
Wele gaethion y cystudd hirfaith
Yn ymuno'n fyddin fawr,
I gyhoeddi rhyddid i'r cenhedloedd
Ac i'r ddynolryw doriad gwawr.
Henffych weithwyr y gwledydd,
Dyma'r frwydr ola'i gyd;
Mae'r undeb rhyngwladol yn newid seiliau'r byd.


My own inclinations are always Internationalist Pacifist - but Daf does not agree that this means voting " REMAIN " even though he enjoys singing " The Internationale / Yr Undeb Rhwngwladal " with some gusto ( provided we all agree to stop a couple of times for smoking & supping and remembering the words.) Any ow, I am challenging Daf to a pwnco here about " LEAVE/ REMAIN " whilst trying to find the time to list all the lies which The Democrats are making - Daf of course will be voting ...

... How can you go around encouraging them Daf - and then complain afterwards ? ... Just think of the children Daf - ! - and try to ignore Billy Bragg's singing out of tune ... & you are wrong : his words are better !

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AeaKII1C-qk
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-36050790


Conservative Jacob Rees-Mogg ... accuses the Remain campaign of using "a misleading figure on jobs - while the figure for the cost of imports if we left the EU is 'unhelpful and tendentious'." ... The Conservative MP also hit out at Chancellor George Osborne over the Treasury claim that leaving the EU would cost households £4,300 each. ...

claiming that it "savages" the Vote Leave campaign.

... Pro-Remain Labour MP Wes Streeting said - " The committee’s report has confirmed everyone’s suspicions about Vote Leave – that they are a bunch of charlatans who mislead the British people and treat parliamentary democracy with contempt." ... Britain Stronger in Europe's press release says the committee described the conduct of Vote Leave’s two senior figures, Matthew Elliott and Dominic Cummings as "appalling”. ... It continues: "Remarkably, the report was signed off by two of the committee’s members, Jacob Rees-Mogg and Steve Baker, who are leading members of Vote Leave." ...

... a new EU poll suggests Remain and Leave are level pegging in Wales, with little change. ...

... UKIP leader Nigel Farage has refused to be drawn on whether he thinks Vote Leave's claim the UK pays £350 million a week to the EU is "misleading". ...Instead Mr Farage, who is not part of the official Vote Leave campaign but is campaigning for "Brexit", told the BBC: ... I always say the same thing - that our net bill for European Union membership is £34 million a day. Fact. Government pink book statistics. And I stick to that and that's unarguable."... Fisheries Minister George Eustice, who supports leaving the EU, has defended Vote Leave's argument that Brexit would save £350m a week as a "fair claim to make". He told the BBC he didn't think it was misleading because the reality was, the UK did send that amount to the EU every week. He says he has never denied that "about half" of that comes back to the UK - but adds that it was "with strings attached". ...

... More on those pesky EU figures ... Vote Leave's Robert Oxley says the campaign's claim that the UK sends £50m a day, or £350m a week, to the EU are a "matter of fact" and an "official statistic". ... He urges people to "go into the account of the ONS (Office for National Statistics) and it's right there". ..."Money comes back, it does come back, but we don't have control of it", he says. ... Just because some of that money, after it's been through the cogs of bureaucracy in Brussels, comes back - that's not a good reason to stay in. There isn't a magical money tree in Brussels that's creating European money - it's money that's come out of British taxpayers' wallets." ... He accuses Chancellor George Osborne of "confusing" the electorate with "ludicrous claims cooked up in the Treasury". ...

The Treasury Select Committee has criticised both sides in the EU Referendum campaign for peddling "misleading" figures and "implausible assumptions". ... Its chair, Andrew Tyrie, told BBC News: "What we really need is an end to the arms race of ever more lurid claims and counter-claims made by both sides."


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36401744

Reality Check: Have the campaigns been fair with figures?


Andrew Tyrie cited the claim that the UK sends £350m a week to Brussels and it could be spent on the NHS instead as particularly problematic. ....The claim ignores the rebate, which means that amount of money is not sent to Brussels each week. Also, some of the money is returned to the UK to be spent on things like farming subsidies and regional development, and Leave campaigners have not suggested these payments should stop.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36073201

Reality Check: Would Brexit cost your family £4,300?


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36358910

Reality Check: Would Brexit create a DIY recession?


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36312223

Reality Check: Are there 2,500 new regulations every year from the EU?


ETC ETC ETC
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why I was thinking of this referendum as being trivial when we ought to think about it being a Trivial decision -

Let's see if this becomes a third post - surveillance interference in file.


Last edited by dai on Sun May 29, 2016 11:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2016 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why I was thinking of this referendum as being trivial when we ought to think about it being a Trivial decision -

http://www.matrifocus.com/SAM07/earth.htm
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2016 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This EU Referendum is not entertaining - examining lies is not as interesting as examining truths because the latter give you things to think about and so can keep your attention involved for months on end - decades even - yet once lies have been exposed for what they are there is nothing to talk about, nothing to do but damn The Democrats in Wales and Westminster - and even that becomes quickly boring ... But honestly, do not stay up late watching Alan Moore : watch these in the morning instead of going to work ... From a text that I can not send at 01.30 am.

I ran across several Shirley Collins tracks & I wonder if you know about them. Here she is being interviewed recently & then - oh =
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=E9lYQ4twWNI =
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKffMePmz9k =
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EuBFd1rlWWA =
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rAxDDqi2tBg

------------------------------
02.00 am ... UGH ... Well I suppose that I ought to say something about these raging ... well, about my raging against what is pretended to be political argumentation ... From whatever directions these assertions come from, pro - con - re - fused, few if any connect with anybody who expresses a different point of view : there is no political argument taking place at all - The Democrats in Wales and Westminster do not know how to do it - because political argument is not part of Democracy. Decisions in Democracy are decided by voting not by debating, and in a " Pure Democracy " which has no consitutional laws to defend the practice of politics - such as in the non-political system whose supporters do not call it " The Dis-United Kingdom " - all that happens in decision making is that a bell rings or something vibrates in an intimate place like a handbag or wallet and The Democrats in Wales and Westminster all troupe off to the end of a desultory uninformed debate held by one or sometimes even two of their number besides the lawyers present desperately watching the clock or playing Tetris in a fold of their ridiculous gowns - until it is time to wake The Presiding Officer to press the lever which pulls the strings which move the clappers which the BBC expertly over-dub to announce the decision made before the election in order to settle The Democrats' expenses.

Real politics involves extended debates conscientiously adjourned to gather new information and hear new arguments e.g. as were conducted over a period of fifty years by some of the most intelligent and skilled negotiators of their time who fashioned the European Community then European Union taken into account matters which may have changed as a result of the treaties but are not understood by those involved now, however clever they are. So millions of hours work by thousands of informed decision makers are to be discarded on a moment's whim - perhaps a fit of gas, or in a state of drunkeness - and no more. Think of it this way : what if the fate of The British Library wereto be decided by illiterates, or famous cathedrals continuation by handing them into the hands of Atheists. Very few people possess the knowledge of the whole system to examine and repair it - most Welsh people do not repair things themselves - and they know nothing of rrepaoring politics because they have been deliberately miseducated in that matter - trained to be passive subjects not citizens. A responsible citizen would refrian from meddling in things that they do understand, and referendums can no understood by the majority of voters who properly ought to honestly decine to participate.
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PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh-god-that-I-do-not-believe-in-but-still-have-faith-in ... will The Deocrats in Westminster try to claim that this EU Referendum is an Act of God not an Act of Parliament in order to deny any responsibility for it - that all bets ... sorry ... insurance premiums pertaining to their political liabilities are now invalid ?

Being bored barely bearing baring boringly bad broadcasts by Big Bible Church - but it does seem to be good news for The Republicans in Wales ... unless they are Polish ... and like chips with your fish ... this suspicion of anybody or anything who looks or sounds a bit foreign tends to recall to us The Thirty Three Penal Laws which basically made being born Welsh a crime for 550+ years ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36389585

" ... The Polish Potatoes Order 2004 makes it illegal for someone to " import into England potatoes which he knows to be or has reasonable cause to suspect to be Polish ... " ... " Section 32 of the Salmon Act 1986 ... Handling a salmon in suspicious circumstances ... is aimed at selling fish gained through illicit means - rather than people furtively skulking around dark corners ... " ... " and selling Welsh salmon perfectly legally to wealthy sportsmen whilst traditional coracle men are refused licences ... " ( ... oh - that last bit was quoting my opinion ... ) ...

For those of you who like coracles and a day out - https://www.facebook.com/pages/Carmarthen-Coracle-Netsmens-Association/444391758914737

Now to go back to all of the trouble caused by immigrants, just look at the state of our streets with all of those fast food cartons, wrappers and tins of what-not : go out into the countryside where I used to work as a younger man teaching elderly farmers to suck eggs - or rather, to blow eggs by the modern methods which were then being recommended by The Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Foolishness - and you will see that long before fast food meant that the buggers could always outrun you, The People in Wales were spreading litterature everywhere ... in fact as soon as it became widely available in those cheap editions which were printed on thin soft paper, The Bible became a best-seller in Wales : some of The People in Wales bought as many as three or four each week ... and so you would find scraps of scripture deposited into hedgerows and streams all over the place, all of them in English however - not in Welsh. ...

... Now the origins of that non-British meal which gave rise to are much disputed, because The People in Ireland were surrounded by seas yet apparently lived only on the coconuts washed up upon their shores from foreign lands until sometime late in the 13c an intrepid small bear arrived in Bantry Bay forlornly clutching a jar with a potato in it because Marmalade had not yet been invented and he detested the taste of Marmite. Hence when he had been standing upon The Shores of Darkest Peru and a bunch of drunken Irish monks had turned up he assured them that he knew the way to America even though nobody had yet discovered it, and in their disappointment afterwards they refused to take him home again. To his horror, once he had arrived upon The Shores of Darkest Ireland, he found out that The People in England had invaded Ireland and declared potatoes to be heretical and possession of them a criminal offence. To his astonishment, The People in Ireland then all wanted to find out about potatoes, to possess one themselves and - since there was a desperate shortage of coconuts - then they tried eating them also ...

... When potatoes arrived in The European Dis-Union they were very popular with almost everyone, especially The People in France who were even more desperately short of coconuts than The People in Ireland and had resorted to eating anything which they could lay their tables with such as snails, frogs and elephants all which they ate deep-fried - which was very cruel to the elephants because they could only find a pan big enough to deep fry them one leg at a time ... but then again, given the size of an elephant and its astounding entertainment value, you would not want to eat a whole elephant all at once ... The People in Poland however were divided over matters of culinary etiquette : half of them detested the Russian service, half of them detested the German and yet another half the Austrian way of doing things, whereas the remaining half were none to keen on the Polish way either ... Although he was making many notes about these hairsplitting disputes between his fellow countrymen and women, basically their gamboling with novel vegetables bored Chopin and so he cashed in his chips and casually declared potatoes to be " too Jewish " - but in thus playing the race card he failed to unite The People in Poland, except against each other ( Jews just did not qualify ? ) ...

... Now the thing about The Jews in Poland was that in their poverty, having fled in their thousands from just about everywhere else and thus having met at the centre of what had been Poland loads of Jewish immigrants coming from all directions they had realised that hanging around in the middle of it was probably the safest place to be - so what were they going to eat ? ... Their boots of course, which is how they came to adapt French cuisine and deep fry whatever was available to them ... which consisted mostly of the potatoes which they were being pelted with by the peculiarly pious Polish peasants ... however, exactly as to whether potatoes were indeed kosher proved to be a problem at first, because of their eyes and their milky blood when cut and their possible resemblance to Jesus, but after decades of scholarship the panel of rabbis assigned to investigate the matter came to agree that what everybody else had been eating for the previous hundred and twenty years was probably not sinful ... after another hundred and twenty years they agreed that it was permissible to sprinkle them with salt and vinegar, although there is still some dispute as to whether the salt ought to take precedence ... two hundred and forty years after this they have decided to agree with everybody else that mayonnaise is very acceptable also ... I am still holding out for piccalilli ...

... Anyhow, sometime in the 19c somewhere in London somebody possibly Polish met somebody possibly Irish and either one of them was possibly frying potatoes and the other possibly frying fish in possibly a third class railway carriage which was possibly originally going to Hull or coming back from Hull which was a town possessed of both potatoes and fish and The People who were Polish or Irish or Jewish or Catholic ... and as is always the case there was a sudden jolt of the train ... and the flying contents of the two frying pans which were hidden behind newspapers from the ticket inspector by these two desperate characters were cooperatively caught in mid air by ... and ... their eyes met for a moment at way over thirty miles an hour : this was how the idea of fast food was finally first born ... oh - and they both had curly red hair ! ... No - I do not have a clue how pickled eggs were introduced, but I do suspect that The People in India are not the only ones to be held responsible for inventing the steak and kidney pie ... Curry of course was invented by The People in Birmingham when they ran out of mayonnaise to put on their fish and chips - and Brummies are all descended from immigrants !

Well ... that has cheered me up - even if it has pissed all of you off !

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Commune ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castor_and_Pollux_%28elephants%29

https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070510122729AAtWiOU

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8419026.stm

http://www.historytoday.com/reviews/fish-chips-history

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fish-Chips-History-Panikos-Panayi/dp/1780233612?tag=duc08-21

There are an astounding number of theories and claims about the origins of Fish & Chips, but Jewish immigrants and Irish navvies frequently feature in them.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-36435288 - Fish eat plastic like teens eat fast food, researchers say - Matt McGrath, Environment correspondent

There has got to be some kind of parallel there with The Voters in Wales ... they are not citizens because the supporters of The United Kingdom are very concerned to ensure that they remain subjects ... much like subjects in other kinds of experiments, the sort in which the animals being used for the purposes of developing new cosmetics are administered successively more poisonous doses according to the amounts which The Democrats in Wales and Westminster think that The People in Wales and The World will tolerate. In Wales apparently more is spent upon each head of our population upon cosmetic politics than is spend upon any other kind of cosmetic procedure : whilst The Democrats in Wales are prepared to pay for the biggest boobs in The World, The People in Wales are rather puzzled as to why they waste the tax money of The People in England ( they have already bankrupted The People in Wales and reduced us all to dependency upon welfare ) on doing this at all when The Welsh Assembly already has the biggest tits in The World ... and no - The European Parliament just can not compete : voting " Leave " in the EU Referendum will result in the money being wasted by Europe being given to The Welsh Assembly to waste even more prodigiously. ...

... Unfortunately it seems that The People in Wales are going to vote " Leave " this week ... they believe what they are told because they have been taught to respect " authority " although nobody has explained to them what this word means : they think that it means doing as the are told because those who bully them into doing what they do not want to do have their best interests at heart e.g. paying off the gambling debts of the bankers, plunging themselves and their as yet unborn children into decades of poverty, homelessness and hopelessness - is a good and noble thing ... Just as a hundred years ago The People in Wales lined up to join up to die and imagined this to be patriotism without ever asking as to why those demanding that they die for them did not consider it to be their loyal duty to their nation(s) to consider how to avoid demanding the lives of their compatriots in the way of pursuing their ambitions ... I think that The People in Wales - much as I feel compassion for them and sentimentality about them - are politically the worst educated in The World and are simply not able to discharge the duties of citizenship and therefore should not be allowed to vote because they are not responsible enough ... and The Democrats in Wales and Westminster were relying on that - but they think that The People in Wales and The World respect their " authority " ...

... i.e. The People in Wales are supposed to be voting for what their self-appointed political leaders The Democrats in Wales and Westminster have told them that they are voting for - but they are not : and now The Democrats in Wales and Westminster are getting panicky - this is not the way that their conception of " Democracy " works ... in Democratic parties, the politicians vote as they are told by the whips of their leaders and they never have to actually consider any of the facts and arguments involved in the business of decision making which The Republicans in Wales call politics ... The Democrats in Wales do not know what politics is, and so when they put an actual political decision into the hands of The People in Wales all hell breaks loose : nobody knows how to do politics ... which is why all that we hear from both " Leave " and " Remain " in the EU Referendum are assertions about how much these options will cost individual voters - yet in or out or shake the UK all about, nobody is able to predict these or any other economic matters even in undisturbed times ... political choices however are less fickle than economic ones in their outcomes and consequences, and The EU Referendum is a political not an economic decision ...

... Yet as in general elections in The United Kingdom, The People in Wales in The EU Referendum are being encouraged to treat their ballot paper as an entry into ... well, in this case a European Lottery ... but politics is not supposed to be conducted as a game of chance, as if entering the polling station were like going into some Welsh Peer's Amusement Arcade and being given just one very special old fashioned penny to spend, because the apparatus has not been updated since 1832 : you may of course be entering the cubicle set aside for the purpose with a sense of uncertainty, full of anxiety lest you grip the paper too hard and embarrass yourself by inadvertently spoiling it - there is never another piece of paper to be had in our archaic political establishments - and when you finally drop yours in and even without seeing it you know that it is just laying there and you are overburdened with such a sense of shame ... well, many often feel politically humiliated without ever being able to name the feeling because they lack the conceptual language for their predicament : there is that nightmare in which you are hopelessly pulling on the lever hoping to flush away the ideas which have been elected into your mind, but The United Kingdom is that one-arm bandit which continually gushes more and more shit each and every time.

So how can we scrub the shit off this election and make the political decision at the heart of it intelligible and clear ... ish ... " Sovereignty " is the idea that both " Remain " and " Leave " are using, and its origins in the political arguments of Hobbes' Leviathan have been discussed above : it was a figment of Hobbes imagination which proved to be an expedient idea at The Restoration and came into its own in The Glorious Revolution. You do not have to read Hobbes and you must not believe me - I write to entertain myself and hopefully a few others - you can work it out for yourself and it is better that you do so : there is only the business of The Social Contract ( another myth - but a lot more plausible than Sovereignty ) and what that implies in the Republican theory of " General Will " is that it is enforceable not because of majority can enforce it upon a minority with sanctions ( as in Democratic theory of Vox Populi Vox Dei ) but because it produces Axioms which are agreed to and abided by ... in other words, not even The State, The Government nor The Law possess any authority nor can anybody be endowed with authority by associating themselves with these things e.g. by election or selection etc - therefore there has never been such a thing as " Sovereignty " and there there never will be : it is a political fiction, and therefore is of no more consequence politically than Noddy and Big Ears, Peter Pan and Wendy ... or Noah and his Ark : useful metaphors, but not political facts.

The political fact is that politics is about making laws : successful laws are well founded upon facts and arguments about how human beings behave, unsuccessful laws are mis-founded upon political fictions - and like Peter Pan and Wendy, the only way to hold them up is with a lot of strings being pulled by others hidden behind the scenery and how they become attached to these is by sleights of hand made onstage within the shadows that are carefully contrived there in plain view ... Like any other amateur dramatics, the on-and-off-stage dramas of The United Kingdom as a amateur and therefore non-political system of government are facilitated by the audience simply editing out the fierce whisperings from the prompt box, and by their indifference to the inconsistencies and sudden changes of plots and characters in the scripts and of course the fact that the productions are not as advertised and everything is shoddy make-believe. In contrast, Republican productions tend to be rather dull and earnest, their casts all behave well and refuse to pretend to be somebody who they are not - and they deliver long informative speeches to the audience and frequently incorporate modern theatrical techniques like " Critical Path Planning for Modern Semiological Presentators " or " Simple Deconstructions for Cones of Uncertainty." Absolutely nobody gets killed in any way and we can not even pay The People in Wales to watch us perform any of them ... just you lot wait until we are The Government of Wales.

Political systems therefore should not be assessed on the same basis that you watch Pobl Y Cwm or Eastenders or Robocop or The Hobbit etc What you want from a political system is a good result i.e. successful laws. It is no good having a political system which can produce really good laws but can not enforce them ... as some argue the problem with The Welsh Assembly to be i.e. if only it had even more devolved powers ... from the point of view of The Republicans in Wales the devolution of powers within the same political system has not halved but doubled The Problems in Wales : we are not interested in The Independence of Wales per se as in our getting better government for our society, and so The Nationalists in Wales pre-occupation with making everything Welsh is to us pointless. On the other hand, the fact that not only have the supporters of The United Kingdom resisted even very moderate Republican proposals for improvements in the political system for over two hundred and fifty years, but that they have over the last forty years destroyed most of the institutions associated with the limited social progress that we have made since the 1530s. Those are the reasons for Republicans wanting to leave The United Kingdom - not to make things Welsh but to make things better.

If the majority of The People in England vote " Leave " in the EU Referendum whilst those in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales ( and possibly some of the neglected regions of England ) vote " Remain " there is going to be a very stark choice before The People In The Peripheries ... for The People in Wales, a lot of the money that we receive for infrastructure development via the EU will disappear : once in the coffers of The United Kingdom it will be used for funding more budget cuts - this will be the most visible effect for most and as the problems pile up they will cease to make the connection with the disconnection made ... I think that the biggest financial headache facing Wales in the next thirty years will be the Victorian sewers at the heart of our sewerage network : most are already twenty years beyond their expiry date and both the cost and complications of replacing them lead me to suspect that The Welsh Government will simply move some communities because it will be cheaper to demolish their villages than to repair them. ... But note : this is a financial problem and should not be the basis upon which to decide how to vote in The EU Referendum, which is a political decision.

" Subsidiarity " is the argument that advocates of the present EU use, and it sounds sort of right to argue that decisions should be taken at the right level ... but the clue here is " level " ... The EU does need to be reformed and here is a political reason why : whilst there are voluminous documents about its constitutional arrangements its actual constitution is not readily comprehensible. On the one hand The European Parliament looks Confederal, on the other The European Courts look Federal, on the third hand individual politicians from different countries use coercive methods to obtain what they want - and sod the Parliament and Courts ... That in my view is where the problem with the European Union is located - it is more or less not a problem with the EU but with Representative Democracy itself, which is not in fact Democracy at all but a political system which evolved in the 18c, 19c and 20c to disguise Aristocracy with voting : The Aristocrats select the candidates and fund the means to get them elected ... Note that in this view of things The Trade Union's leaders in possessing the means for economic coercion in being able to direct their members, and in drawing large salaries from them, are wielding illicit political power and therefore Ultraists and so are to be counted amongst The Aristocrats : The EU is a modern feudal state - like The UK.

What The Nationalists in Wales want is their very own modern feudal state, they simply want what they perceive everybody else has - and The Republicans in Wales see that as the limit of their horizons : micking others ... But politics requires understanding of the de facto situations that the laws to be made must address : the rationality of good decision making is to obtain this understanding, which means obtaining the facts ... The logic of Ultraism is to seize as much power as possible and hold it, hence Cameron & Co will not release " Sovereignty " to either Scotland or Europe - their " Sovereignty " is simply nothing more than seizing power, there is no political principle to this other perhaps than denying The Rule of Law i.e. that those claiming " Sovereignty " can act with impunity, that those making the laws are not subject to them : this can not be called a political principle - this is the non-principle of The Ultraists which underpins the non-political system whose supporters do not call it The Dis-United Kingdom, which has terrorised Wales and The World for centuries. The Republicans in Wales reject Ultraism as the basis of any political system, for although we can not wholly eradicate it we must not treat it as legitimate or even lawful but strive instead to establish political systems based upon Altruism, upon consenting human relationships - not upon nation-states whose supporters claim that " Sovereignty " entitles them to coerce any others found upon those territories which they deem to be their property. Modern Republican Cosmopolitanism anticipates the annihilation of the geographically defined coerced political system in favour of socially defined consented political systems based upon such things as shared languages, cultures, economics and other activities.

What that means in practice is such things as the postal service or using the internet : in a world where we are compelled to live in geographically based nation-states we are prey to whichever Ultraists seize control of them - and proclaim their authority, which in Wales means that millions will be nodding their heads and saying things like " Well, they have got the political authority now you know - so we should do as they say : they won the election you know, all fair and un-square and chwarae teg like - under these new rules, where they are elected once they have killed all of those who object to them - you have got to be proud, haven't you : the way that The Democrats in Wales are leading the world in these new cutting-edge developments in re-defining what the word ' Democracy ' really means, look you ! " We need the biggest political systems which we can contrive to resist The Ultraists, but when we create things like The EU and The UN to deal with international and global problems using political means we need to be careful to give them no more scope for their power than for specific tasks - we definitely do not want a single huge monolithic global government : that is what The Ultraists want, to persuade us all to agree to their legitimacy and to endorse and to fund their oppressing us - !

There have of course been a number of Republicanisms over the centuries, most based upon geographical states, but the underlying principle in Republicanism is to resist the concentration of power in any one place e.g. to refuse to have a large professional army and to ensure that it can not seize power in a coup by having a very large but divided amateur militia which can overwhelm a rebel army with simple weapons pitched against sophisticated arms. More importantly from the point of view of Nomocracy, any government institutions - e.g. Democratic Assemblies - whilst active are subject to The Rule of Law, but The Judiciary whilst independent and having the most power are forced into a passive role. By creating multiple but independent, interwoven but separate jurisdictions, the hierarchical, pyramidical nature of early Republican Cosmopolitan solutions for a global polity is got rid of : this is largely the result of The New Republicanism of the early 20th century - it was a result of the first wave of the cheap long distance communications necessary for Cosmopolitanism to become a reality. The ideal is to have a very flat, closely interwoven structure - but not the disappearance of the state which The Anarchists advocate : Republicanism recognises the need for a defense against those who will use violence against others.
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dai



Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Posts: 2853

PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mean to go back to the above and try to bend & shape it ... but I am knackered ... it is too hot ... it must be nearly 20 Centigrade ... I can not handle this ... and it could get much worse ... if Wales becomes too hot to handle, what will they do with us ? ... Ah well, there are always the philosophical consolations to be had when living in The Land of Song -

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DC8ioZkb-Sc
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dai



Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Posts: 2853

PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is so much garbage being broadcast by The Democrats in Wales and Westminster about The EU Referendum I do not feel like wasting my time on their claims and counter-claims ... I do have other recreations ... well ... many ... all related ... I will try to get the photo of the wobbly example up later ... soon ... here are a few links to those still advocating Noah's Laws as the basis of peace between nations ... some hope, but The Noahide Law argument of Renissance Republicanism ( 1450-1650 ) is a nice example of a long-lived ( still living ) version of Nomocracy which preceded The Natural Law arguments of Neo-Classical Republicanism ( 1650-1850 ) and the pseudo-scientific arguments to be found in Modernist Republicanism ( 1850-2050 ? ) still draw on such ideas but now clothed them Darwinian theories about the development of our social behaviours.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Laws_of_Noah ... http://noahide.org/

I JUST KNOW THAT I OUGHT TO READ THIS - BUT I AM GOING TO BED - http://noahide.org/2016/01/19/chapter-5-2/ -

" Sovereignty, Persons and The Noahide Laws : Legal-political perspectives."

" ... The sources of modern international law are customary international law, based on practices which nations chose to observe; an International Court of Justice, to which nations elect to subscribe; a United Nations, the members of which stand in political relationships to one another, where also certain nations possess veto powers; and finally the contractual activity of nations in treaty-making. The common feature of all of these aspects of international law is that they are essentially voluntary; they represent elective commitments of sovereign nations, which are bound to no moral or legal authority above their individual sovereign existences, except to the extent that they chose to subscribe or be bound by one. That authority, at all events, is not absolute. ... This is the character of modern international law, the law which was formulated and practised in modern times since the Renaissance and the Enlightenment. It corresponds to the political reality of the rise of sovereign national entities. This law was historically preceded by a different political reality and different notions of law. In ancient and medieval times, before the emergence of sovereignty as a universal principle of states, there prevailed a notion of natural law. This was the concept of a concrete morality of universal application which governed states just as municipal or domestic law governs the individuals within a single state. ... "

[ THE FOLLOWING DAY I STARTED TO READ THE REST OF IT - UGH : DO NOT BOTHER, THAT WAS THE BEST OF IT - THE GUY IS NOT REALLY INTERESTED IN JUSTICE.]




From:
To:
Subject: FW: Y Ddraig Goch a'r Faner Noa [ er ? Y Ddraig Goch ar Y Faner Noa ? ]
Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2016 23:27:09 +0000

Dear XXXX,

have you noticed these ?

David B. Lawrence

Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2016 23:09:11 +0100
Subject: Y Ddraig Goch a'r Faner Noa
From:
To:
CC:

I had not noticed these until I came across the wobbly example which I photographed. As I understand it Y Faner Noa / The Noahide Flag has its origins in that part of The Peace Movement which has its roots in The Rule of Law i.e. in the 16-17c Religious Republicans thought that The Seven Laws of Noah - as symbolised by the rainbow - could become the universal basis for peace between all nations. Since the 1960s or so these flags have proliferated and their origins have become obscured by their colour order being changed and commonly reduced to six, and now they are commonly associated with LGBT rights etc without the basis of these in Nomocratic political theory being explicit because The People in Wales do not know that " Y Faner Enfys " is historically a flag which refers to Nomocracy, to The Rule of ( Natural ) Law, to Republicanism in Wales and The World. ...

... One problem that The People in The LBGT Community should beware of - The Fourth Noahide Law bans illicit sexual relationships : The Rainbow Flag can be interpreted to be a symbol of being anti-LGBT ...

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Welsh-Rainbow-Flag-PEACE-Wales-Cymraeg-Red-Dragon-Occupy-Gay-Celebrate-festival-/181026197224

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

POST SCRIPT 16-06-16 - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-36538429

" ... The rainbow flag's adoption as a symbol for the LGBT community dates back to 1978, when San Francisco-based artist Gilbert Baker released his original eight-colour design. The first hand-sewn versions flew on 25 June, Gay Freedom Day. ...

... "It replaced the use of the pink triangle, which was itself reclaimed from its use as a symbol of oppression in Nazi Germany," says Tatchell. "The rainbow flag is a more positive, uplifting symbol."

The eight different colours of Baker's original flag each represented a different aspect of life. These were:

Pink - sexuality

Red - life

Orange - healing

Yellow- sunlight

Green - nature

Turquoise - art

Indigo - harmony

Violet - human spirit

The number of stripes was later reduced to six. Blue replaced turquoise and pink and indigo were removed. ... "


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There was actually some interesting comments about the EU Referendum this evening on BBC R4's " Any Questions ? " - http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07cyvkp - and that will be repeated tomorrow 1pm Saturday 4th June 2016 followed by " Any Answers ? " at 2pm ... well at least this makes this a post relevant to the subject ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07cyvkp ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07cmk2g ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07bzhrd

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I AM JUST REVIEWING THE ABOVE BEFORE SWITCHING OFF AND I AM SUDDENLY AWARE THAT THOSE WHO HAVE SEEN ME SKETCHING " THE MODEL " MAY NOW ASSUME THAT IT HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE NOAHIDE LAWS AND RENAISSANCE ( RELIGIOUS ) REPUBLICANISM ( 1450-1650 ) NO ... IT IS MOSTLY TO DO WITH THE IMAGERY USED BY NEO-CLASSICAL ( PHILOSOPHICAL ) REPUBLICANISM ( 1650-1850) - VOLTAIRE AND NEWTON, DE TRACEY AND LAMARCK, GOETHE AND CHEVREUL, BELLERS AND DALTON ETC ... IN THE LATTER PART OF THIS PERIOD THE AMERICAN REPUBLICAN LEADER BENJAMIN FRANKLIN AND THE WELSH REPUBLICAN LEADER DAVID WILLIAMS WERE FRIENDS AND COLLABORATORS IN " THE THIRTEEN CLUB " AND IT IS THE LATTER'S ASSOCIATION WITH BOTH THE AMERICAN AND FRENCH REVOLUTIONS THAT I LIKE TO QUIETLY ANNUALLY COMMEMORATE WITH A PIC-NIC AT THE MONUMENT TO HIM IN CAERPHILLY EACH BASTILLE DAY - 14TH JULY - " Y DYDD RYDD " ... AND IF YOU THINK THAT I SIMPLY MAKE EVERYTHING UP THAT I WRITE ON " Y REPWBLIC " YOU SHOULD SEE MY DECADES OF NOTES ... IDEAS WHICH HAVE MOSTLY NEVER BEEN SEEN BY OTHERS ... AND WILL NOW MOSTLY NEVER ...

http://repwblic.informe.com/viewtopic.php?t=1308 - Y DYDD RHYDD - 2016 GORFFENHAF 14 - BASTILLE DAY




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[ TWO DAYS LATER - I HAVE DECIDED TO USE ONE OF THOSE IMAGES TO ANSWER A QUESTION PUT TO ME OFF THE BOARD ABOUT REPWBLIC.]



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