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'Jac o' the North'
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marianneh



Joined: 30 May 2013
Posts: 1893

PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:33 am    Post subject: Teach Mamgu to Suck Eggs Reply with quote

Is Jacques Protic going to give Jac lessons in bigotry? Perhaps he can fit them in after teaching his dear babushka to suck eggs.

Jac describes Jacques as a Serb 'pretending to be an Englishman.' It's a glaring example of how much of reality is missed by Jac.

A child has a right to its parents' nationality by 'jus sanguinis.' It also has a right to take its nationality from its place of birth by 'jus soli', even if its parents come from somewhere else.

It is not a pretence. It is not sinister.

Jac finds it unacceptable that a person can be both Serbian and English or both an athlete and an amputee. How he must have hated Venn diagrams when he was at school!

Most of us have no problem with the concept that a person can at the same time be a cyclist and a lesbian and a Liberal Democrat. Jac's mental rigidity is a big problem for him and his fans.

Aged 14, I was struggling with Welsh homework. As Celtic languages split off from other European languages a long time ago in evolutionary terms, it can be very difficult to cope with the complicated grammar if it is not your first language, at least if you are being taught in a dull, conventional way.

I finished it with a sigh, then went to watch some TV. Johnny Speight was on the screen as Alf Garnet. He was ranting, ''Welsh! That's not a language! Yacky Da! Yacky Da! It's just making noises like a dog making noises!''

Perhaps I was too young and literal minded to appreciate that it was supposed to be satire. I was stung.

I deeply resented that I was struggling manfully with a language that had a grammar at least as complicated as Latin which I had also learnt. And far from getting any kudos, this guy was now denying that it was a real language at all!

Johnny Speight was satirising bigotry. But I've heard other people say it and mean it.

What else do people say? They say that Welshmen live in caves. According to A N Wilson, we are dingy, untalented and sly or at least appear to be.

In 'Men Behaving Badly', one character says he is going on holiday to Wales, and he is also hoping to experience sex. He says, ''It's been so long, I can't remember what it's like.''

He was referring to sex not Wales, but his flatmate says, ''It has some nice scenery but the natives are suspicious of outsiders.'' This gets a laugh.

English people often perversely express intolerance of the Welsh by claiming that the Welsh are racist and intolerant. I don't think there's really much truth in this claim, but Jac and his fan club are going out of their way to live down to the stereotype.

Just think of A A Gill's horrible insult. He said we were 'loquacious, dissemblers, immoral liars, stunted, bigoted, dark, ugly, pugnacious little trolls.' And this was before the age of the internet troll. That's exactly what this lot are like!

I don't really think that they are a deep cover anti-Welsh outfit, dedicated to destroying our credibility. But if they were, they couldn't be doing a better job.

I'm naturally very lazy. But I was driven to throwing myself into learning Welsh because I was in high dudgeon after being exposed to anti-Welsh bigotry.

I immersed myself in the culture. I listened with rapture to 'Rhyd-y-Groes', 'Bryn Calfaria' and 'Crugybar.' They were spine tingling.

After receiving Jac's poisonous e-mail, I can't thrill to this music anymore. I'd made fair progress with my Welsh lessons but I told my partner that after the scarifying encounter with Jac, I was thinking of giving them up.

He said, ''Paid bod twpsyn'' ie 'Don't be an idiot.' My attitude to my Welsh lessons now is 'I've started so I'll finish' but I don't feel the same zest.

I wonder how many other people Jac and his friends have put off. Phoning people to tell them, ''I'm going to do your fecking head in'' isn't going to make them eager to embrace your fascinating culture. It makes you look like a half witted barbarian who's only ever seen a culture at the bottom of a pirex dish.

Menaces aren't going to make people respect your language. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

So how to go about it? I haven't really had any success with my children who repeat anti-Welsh canards even when they contradict each other.

My husband was happy for them to have Welsh story books as 'they would have to learn it in school anyway'. But he was giving them mixed messages.

Our son Taliesin has a Welsh first name only because I bumped up against another one of my husband's ethnic buttons. This was before British people began to express racist feelings about East Europeans.

I was thinking of calling the baby Dmitri. My husband exclaimed, ''What? Dmitri! Russian crap! Bulgarian crap! He will have a Welsh name!''

The 'Cariad@Iaith' series showcases not concentrating too hard which is counter productive. You can pick up the language while doing other things such as throwing soft toys around even if you are grown up. I wish they used this method more in schools.

I'm glad that the Roald Dahl, Jacqui Wilson and Harry Potter series are now available in Welsh. I've started reading 'Sgwp' by Lois Arnold which is funny with a lot of sly local in-jokes.

I'm also part of the way through 'Dyddiadur Anne Frank' translated by Eigra Lewis Roberts. This is one of the most recent translations. It's a pity it wasn't available when I was growing up.

I think what would really save the language would be if we had a phenomenal explosion of child and adolescent friendly literature, art, films, and general culture. My eldest son was drawn into pokemon, anime and Manga comics.

He is in love with Japan, writes haikus - which are very good- and has taught himself Japanese even though it is objectively difficult, and is written in two scripts, one based on Chinese characters, and the other which I call 'Lady Novelists' Script' because I can't remember what it should be called.

I thought it was just him. But I know now that all sorts of kids of his generation have plunged into Japanese language and culture.

This is all the more remarkable when you consider that less than a generation ago someone chopped down the flagpole flying the rising sun standard at a Mitsubishi plant in the valleys. My son was seriously upset when I told him that I was pushing him in a pram past Cardiff Castle when Emperor Akihito was there on a state visit.

As the emperor came out everyone booed and some turned their backs. I booed too, but did feel a heel when I saw the Japanese children waving Welsh and Japanese flags. This was before Akihito expressed 'deep remorse' for the sins of his father,

Welsh language and culture were given a bit of a fillip by Superted from 1982 onwards. But apparently Superted now needs a makeover because it is too cruel to fat people.

I wouldn't say it totally dispelled anti-Welsh feeling in popular culture. I'd been enjoying a book which was being amusing and arch about Andy Pandy and other cultural icons of my infancy. But the writer turned on Superted in disgust, without explaining what he didn't like about it.

I think it was instinctive anti-Welsh feeling. A reviewer reacted with the same visceral revulsion to the 'Simpsons' episode where Lisa is inspired to support Cornish nationalism.

I don't think we can replicate the Japanese experience in a businesslike, preplanned way as a matter of public policy. These things have to be spontaneous.

You can never know what will catch the public imagination. But it would be marvellous if it did happen.
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marianneh



Joined: 30 May 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2015 4:42 pm    Post subject: brothers and sisters Reply with quote

I became aware after finishing the above post that Dai's put up a very interesting post over on page one alluding to the politics of narcissism and psychopathy. I urge you to click on the links if you haven't yet done so. They're full of useful insights.

I hope to come back and deal with the issues Dai has raised in a more direct way later. But first I think we should ask ourselves about what this independent Welsh state would be like that Jac wants, the one where the indigenous Welsh will be privileged in the allocation of housing and presumably other things too.

It would be a state based on the purity of the blood. It would have a hierarchical caste system. Perhaps to qualify for full privileges you would have to prove that you were pure and perfect -physically perfect that is.

This grading of people would be interesting but difficult to put into practice. Maybe if you had adolescent acne, you would lose caste for a few years.

I fear it would be unworkable in the light of present knowledge of DNA and human origins. In the American South under Jim Crow laws, a notice might proclaim, 'Entry to this building is forbidden to those of African descent.'

Now, we would look at that and think, ''What, everybody?'' The 'Out of Africa' hypothesis has stacked up, the more we find out about human origins. We are all of African descent.

Bonnie Greer sat next to Nick Griffin of the BNP on Question Time. She could hardly bring herself to look at him. I think she was afraid that she would hit him if she did.

But she managed to explain clearly and succinctly why there are no indigenous British. By the same token, there are no indigenous Welsh either.

I visualise a state where there are a lot of serfs looking for a superior caste to tell them what to do, but where nobody can be found who qualifies to lord it over the rest of us. At least my favourite joke will become prophetic:
'What's the racially pure Welsh market town near the English border? Punchline: Ubergavenny!'

What is particularly cheeky about the 'indigenous Welsh' line is that it seeks racial privilege while playing on connotations of victimisation. It's as if the Welsh had been as badly treated as Native Americans or Australian Aborigines or even the hairy Ainu in Japan.

It calls to mind a notorious Ukip poster showing an aged Native American with lines of suffering etched on his face. The caption says,' He didn't care about immigration. Now he lives on a reservation'.

What? Can he remember the Pilgrim Fathers coming over in 1620 then? Was he at the first thanksgiving dinner? No wonder he looks so old and frail!

In Jac's Wales, people wouldn't be valued on their merits. They would be assigned to a superior or inferior status based on some arbitrary trait or an accident of birth.

It would be a bit like Mesopotamia under Hammurabi, where if a superior man blinds another superior man he shall be blinded, but if the victim is a commoner, he need only pay 60 shekels of silver.

It is more jarring that if a superior man strikes a superior woman and 'thereby causes her to miscarry her foetus', he shall pay 60 shekels of silver...If that woman should die, they shall kill his daughter, but if it is a common woman, he shall pay 30 shekels. Furthermore, if a house falls down and kills the owner's son, the builder's son shall be killed.

It doesn't sound very fair especially to the blameless son and daughter. But this is what happens when you have no interest in other people as personalities, but judge them on some predetermined system of demarcation which has no connection with intrinsic merit.

Even the trashiest of historical novels can show us how sensibilities have changed over time. It looks as if people in the past didn't pride themselves on their personal qualities. They were proud of their ancestry, at least if they had noble or royal blood.

According to Elaine Morgan, it was only in the 70s that snobbery began to seem a bit off, and became unfashionable. She thought it was only then that people really began to notice what other people were like as individuals or to think that it mattered.

Jac's attitude to his neighbour is that he is an 'arsehole.' Why? Because he's English. He doesn't need any more information. His neighbour's behaviour and character are neither here nor there.

If that's your attitude, you're going to make awful mistakes again and again. We saw a guy on TV who let a woman who looked like a plastic Barbie doll move in with him.

His daughter and her friend suspected the woman was a con merchant, out to take him for everything he had. They went to the police station to discuss their fears.

The policeman put the woman's name in the computer, and then rushed back to the desk, shouting agitatedly, ''Where is she? Where is she?''

The woman was wanted for several serious crimes of deception. When the guy was interviewed on TV, he was still proud of the criteria he judged the woman on before giving her unrestrained access to his house and bank account.

She looked like a supermodel. ''I don't go out with ugly birds!'' he bragged, proud of his high standards. He still couldn't see any further than that.

I'm beginning to see a deeper significance in John Tyler's words when he contrasted Jac with Martin Luther King who had a dream that one day his children would be judged not on the colour of their skin but the content of their characters. Jac would turn the clock back if he could.

But I would like to suggest that he is not representative of Welsh people in this. Eileen Beasley is often referred to in Wales as 'our Rosa Parks'. Some people who think Welsh culture is worth preserving, identify with the civil rights movement.

When four young girls were killed in a white supremacist bombing at a church in Birmingham Alabama in 1963, one of their white neighbours had this to say, ''People say they were children. They weren't. Children means little people and that means little white people. They were niggahs!''

I'm thankful to say that the response in Wales was rather different. People donated shillings and half crowns to a tribute. John Petts of Llansteffan, Carmarthenshire created a memorial window in stained glass.

The pastor in the rededicated church in Birmingham Alabama often pauses to look at the memorial window donated by 'the people of Wales'. He thinks it is wonderful that people 'half a world away' should choose to affiliate with ...African Americans.'

He said, ''It reminds us that the world is smaller than we think and that there are brothers and sisters somewhere else who thought about us.''

Jac and his friends may try to show us up but they do not represent Wales. John Petts, Nye Bevan, Tanni Grey-Thompson, the young Lloyd George and the mature Charlotte Church will be remembered long after Jac's 'poisonous bile' has been consigned to the dustbin of history.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2015 6:53 pm    Post subject: Jac's incomprehension Reply with quote

In a letter to the 'Western Mail', Jac said it was 'incomprehensible' that Welsh people tended to vote for left wing parties. According to him, these parties just want to use them for 'vote fodder'.

He makes it sound as bad as being recruited for cannon fodder but it surely can't be. It's obviously beyond his comprehension that his compatriots support the left, but most people wouldn't find it hard to understand at all.

In the early twentieth century when the franchise was expanding, most Welsh people were living in miserable poverty, often employed in dangerous heavy industries.

Of course they voted for parties that gave them the hope of a better world. You only have to evoke the place names Gresford and Senghenydd to understand why they would not vote Conservative.

They may indeed have had such generosity of spirit that they identified with all 'the workers of the world' and cheered on the revolution in Russia. But even if they didn't, they would have perceived that joining a trade union made good sense.

The minister in the cemetery in Llanelli stood by the graves of our working class martyrs in 2011 and said ''They did not die in vain...because we are here today....We will go forth perhaps with a better spirit in our hearts, seeking to extend those things that they died for...justice, truth and right...seeking the equality of all.''

Dafydd ap Geler Thomas said ''Amen'' with some feeling, but to Jac who was also present, the words probably just sounded like platitudes. He would have been even less impressed when Tim Evans quoted the words on a martyr's gravestone: 'Workers of the World Unite.'

Obviously, Jac's mental rigidity has done him no favours here. He's not interested in people and he doesn't understand them. He also thinks it's their fault that he can't understand them.

Jac identifies with Wales completely but has no point of contact with most of the people who live here. He's frustrated because they are not what he thinks they should be.

I won't say that his right wing stance is unWelsh. You can have any opinion and still be Welsh. But it's a minority view which he can't imprint on others.

The one area where I do sympathise with his frustration is in language policy. I'd be delighted if most people were eager to revive our dear mamiaith which I associate with all my earliest memories.

It brings to the surface all the hiraeth in my soul. But if others feel differently, what can you do?

In his 'History of Wales', John Davies said that although the countries that would later make up Yugolavia had been ruled as virtual slave states by the Austrians and the Turks, children were taught in their own languages in schools from the 1870s.

Serbo-Croat was in much the same state as Welsh in the 1870s. And if only children in Welsh schools had been educated in Welsh from the 1870s onwards, perhaps our language would be as robust as Serbian and Croatian now.

Incidentally Serbo-Croat may also have been saved by the lackadaisical attitude of the central government to education. My husband assumes his mother went to school because she lived in a city. But he suspects his father may never have gone to school.

He grew up in a village where there was no school and no surfaced road leading to another village. Apparently, education wasn't compulsory in Yugoslavia until after the Second World War.

Perhaps Welsh has gone past a tipping point. Perhaps it is too late to revive it in any meaningful way at least in populous areas. I would be heartbroken if that was the case. But on a rational level, I know there are more important things.

Jac wants more than language revival. He obviously wants a Utopian society based on right wing tenets.

One man's Utopia is another man's dystopia. I think a tourist would come to Jac's Wales and say, in the words of Max Beerbohm Tree, ''Utopia? Oh pardon me. I thought it was Hell.''

It seems to me that Jac is to Welsh identity what Mark Thatcher was to the Conservative election campaign in 1983. Young Thatcher asked a senior aide, ''How can I help my mother win the election?'' The wise old sage growled, ''Leave the country!''

Similarly, on any objective measure, the most patriotic thing Jac could do would be to close down his blog and draw no further attention to himself.

But he doesn't think so. His spouting are incredibly prolific. If you ever look for a specifically Welsh blog, a myriad of Jac o' the North excerpts come up. giving him a spurious significance.

But let's do a little thought experiment. If Jac had been born on the other side of the Severn bridge, with the same personality, brain and formative experiences, he would still be putting up intolerant and inflammatory posts. But the Welsh would be among his perceived enemies.

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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:48 pm    Post subject: A Plague Reply with quote

Gareth Jones, a Welsh journalist, is now recognised as one of the greatest 'eyewitnesses of truth.' He exposed Stalin's terror famine in the 1930s. It was not just in Ukraine as I previously thought.

Jones wrote, 'This cry came from every part of Russia, from the Volga, Siberia, White Russia, the North Caucasus and Central Asia.'

But it's no doubt true that Ukraine was especially badly affected. Then in 1986, still under Soviet domination, came the Chernobyl disaster. For the first few days, the Kremlin tried to cover it up.

I gave a handful of coins to a woman in the street who was collecting donations for 'the children of Chernobyl.' When I tried to get information out of her about how the fallout affects the kids, she wasn't very forthcoming.

The wind was blowing in the direction of Croatia that day. My husband thinks that this is to blame for his parents and sister dying of cancer. It's an open question. Cancer is common enough anyway.

The wind was definitely blowing towards Wales on the day in question. That's why we had radioactive sheep.

Without knowing much more about the place, I saw Ukraine as having a tragic history, at least in the twentieth century.

My friend Liz was startled when a woman in the Netherlands told her ''I support your Plaid Cymru''.

I suppose it's just a reflex action, to support those who are apparently being oppressed. Similarly, my first reaction to Putin casting greedy eyes on Ukraine, was to root for the Ukrainians.

After all, one town that had been founded by a Welshman, Hughes, decided to secede from the whole sorry mess and declare allegiance to his home country. But I'd have been more impressed had they been able to tell Wales apart from the English home counties.

They think we express our national identity by drinking tea at four o'clock and singing 'God Save the Queen.' It's truly humbling.

I'm sure we felt appropriate sympathy when we saw Russian troops massing at the border, exuberantly homophobic, chanting, ''We are coming for you, Ukrainian faggots!''

But when we saw a witless Ukrainian nationalist street fighter saying he would battle the Russians and the Jews while there was blood in his veins, our eyes glazed over. He was shot dead almost immediately afterwards.

We've seen Ukrainian politicians fighting like schoolboys in the Parliament Chamber. You can see a video of the Ukrainian minister for freedom of speech forcing a political opponent to take back what he said by dragging him around his office by his tie.

At least the minister for freedom of speech has a magnificent pony tail. You can't take that away from him.

Even Yulia Tymoshenko who had been seen as a prisoner of conscience may have a dark side, given her remarks on ethnicity. There must be decent people in Ukraine who deserve our support.

But I can't be bothered any longer. When you see how immature some of these people are, it makes one side look as bad as the other. That's not a fair reaction but it is inevitable.

This should be a warning to Jac and his ilk that if you behave extremely badly, people will lose interest in you grievances even if they are well founded. I now look wearily at Ukraine and think, 'A plague on both your houses!'


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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:21 am    Post subject: Tim o' the South Reply with quote

Howard Jacobson conflated the revival of Cornish language and culture with racism. He didn't know anything about linguistics. He didn't even know the difference between accent and dialect.

At a Cornish festival, while the locals sang lustily 'Unite and Unite', Howard Jacobson scolded a youth in the crowd. ''Why are you stepping on the toes of that old man?'' he demanded.

As he saw it, Cornish culture was just bullying in fancy dress. I reassured myself that it couldn't be true.

Tim Saunders is a major figure in the revival of Cornish. He invented a Cornish word for television on a train journey.

Tim is witty, civilized, a polyglot. It's entirely the fault of my own patheticness that we no longer keep in touch.

When I worry about nationalists like Jac, the thought of Tim is like a talisman. There are delightful and empathetic people who think Celtic culture and autonomy are good things.

As I saw it, Tim was at the opposite end of the spectrum from Jac. So I was intrigued when Tim put up a site called 'Tim o' the South' in allusion to Jac.

In this he expressed disagreement with one or two things that Jac had said in a particular piece, while conceding that he was right on other things. He set out a well argued case.

He wore his erudition lightly but you could tell it was there. He was relaxed, humorous, almost playful.

Jac reacted as if he had been personally threatened by a sinister enemy. He repeated his case without adducing evidence. When Tim expected him to support his argument with empirical data, he went into meltdown.

He thought that was a totally unreasonable request. For Jac is not batting in the same game as the rest of us. He fell back on his old favourite, personal abuse. He'd be speechless without it.

As a matter of interest, the point at issue was whether Wales needed more or fewer politicians. Tim made it clear that he didn't think much of the Daily Mail or right wing paramilitary troops. Perhaps he thought that he and Jac were on common ground here.

Jac's meltdown was very similar to the one he had when I had the audacity to tell him that disabled people were human. One minute he was saying he was big and hard. Then I said ''boo'' and he was apparently quivering under a chair.

I was blindsided by this as I wasn't familiar with the tactics of the classic crybully in those days. I thought perhaps he needed help. But it was obvious to me that he was angry and sadistic even while he was going to pieces.

John Tyler has said that he wishes that, instead of accusing other people of persecuting him, Jac would just come out and say openly that he hates them. Well, Tim induced Jac to do it.

I'll share with you the salient parts. Jac said, 'You are surely too clever to have misread my piece, so you must have chosen to misrepresent it. The question is, why. If you have something to say about where I stand politically, then have the balls to say it openly.'

He went on: 'I hate socialism; I hate the Labour party; but perhaps most of all I hate 'nationalists' for whom Labour is their next favourite team.'

I shared this with my partner. He said, ''Well, who does he like, then?'' The answer must be, 'Very few people indeed.'

Not only does he hate Serbs who 'pretend' to be English and the English arsehole who lives next door. He hates perhaps the majority of Welsh nationalists and certainly all those Welsh people who are not nationalists.
Don't even ask how he feels about Maoris and Jamaicans.

With admirable self restraint, Tim replied, 'Additional unsubstantiated assertions, accompanied by not quite accurate ( to express it diplomatically) personal abuse, are in effect an admission of a lost argument. At best, we should have to agree to differ. The present exchange is now at an end. Hwyl fawr am y tro!'

But Jac had not finished. He lurched back onstage to state,' Listen Tim, I didn't mean to back back [sic] here, son, but it's 2 am and I've had a bottle of Argie Cabernet Sauvignon, so I'm going to say a few things.

'You have used terms here like 'Verb Sap', 'You must advance evidence'...'It is patient of the view'...'duffers currently folding currency...These are silly expressions I wouldn't use even if I was being facetious, or humorous. Telling me that you are a precious, over-wrought, self-regarding little man.

'As for believing that the 'Welsh' Assembly would be improved by the addition of an anti-Welsh bastard like Bryant tells me you are more concerned with - what you perceive to be - the future of mynation [sic]. (The 'my' was italicised.)My nation takes precedence over all.'

My partner commented, ''Wow! He really knows how to get on with people doesn't he?''

What can one say, even taking into account that this was drink fuelled? Freudian psychology is seen as a lot of nonsense these days but it did have just a few valuable insights. It's spot on with projection in Jac's case.

'Precious, over-wrought and self-regarding'. It's such an accurate description of himself that it is like witchcraft. How narcissistic can you get? He identifies himself with Wales as Hitler identified himself with Germany and Stalin did with Russia.

As for the 'weepy narcissistic self pity', he should apply to be an honorary Serb! Note that Jac doesn't even in theory accept that he should adduce evidence to support his statements. Indeed, he thinks it is a 'silly' idiosyncratic quirk of Tim's.

So he is guarded against reality checks. When I first saw this, I was quite distressed for Tim. I urged him to take nothing Jac said literally.

I said he was just externalising issues he had about paranoia and hatred. His thoughts were only of interest from a psychiatric point of view.

I'm surprised Tim allowed this past moderation. Phil Parry hasn't considered it. He sees Jac as a malefactor who is responsible for his actions. But he has described him as pathetic.

Perhaps the most wearing thing is that Jac has a histrionic meltdown if anyone even mildly disagrees with him. But if he notices that he has upset someone else, he is over the moon. I'm thinking of his headline: 'OMG! I've upset the progressives!'

My advice is don't try to communicate directly with him at all. If you're sufficiently concerned about something, discuss it with the police.


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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:30 am    Post subject: Tim o' the South Reply with quote

Howard Jacobson conflated the revival of Cornish language and culture with racism. He didn't know anything about linguistics. He didn't even know the difference between accent and dialect.

At a Cornish festival, while the locals sang lustily 'Unite and Unite', Howard Jacobson scolded a youth in the crowd. ''Why are you stepping on the toes of that old man?'' he demanded.

As he saw it, Cornish culture was just bullying in fancy dress. I reassured myself that it couldn't be true.

Tim Saunders is a major figure in the revival of Cornish. He invented a Cornish word for television on a train journey.

Tim is witty, civilized, a polyglot. It's entirely the fault of my own patheticness that we no longer keep in touch.

When I worry about nationalists like Jac, the thought of Tim is like a talisman. There are delightful and empathetic people who think Celtic culture and autonomy are good things.

As I saw it, Tim was at the opposite end of the spectrum from Jac. So I was intrigued when Tim put up a site called 'Tim o' the South' in allusion to Jac.

In this he expressed disagreement with one or two things that Jac had said in a particular piece, while conceding that he was right on other things. He set out a well argued case.

He wore his erudition lightly but you could tell it was there. He was relaxed, humorous, almost playful.

Jac reacted as if he had been personally threatened by a sinister enemy. He repeated his case without adducing evidence. When Tim expected him to support his argument with empirical data, he went into meltdown.

He thought that was a totally unreasonable request. For Jac is not batting in the same game as the rest of us. He fell back on his old favourite, personal abuse. He'd be speechless without it.

As a matter of interest, the point at issue was whether Wales needed more or fewer politicians. Tim made it clear that he didn't think much of the Daily Mail or right wing paramilitary troops. Perhaps he thought that he and Jac were on common ground here.

Jac's meltdown was very similar to the one he had when I had the audacity to tell him that disabled people were human. One minute he was saying he was big and hard. Then I said ''boo'' and he was apparently quivering under a chair.

I was blindsided by this as I wasn't familiar with the tactics of the classic crybully in those days. I thought perhaps he needed help. But it was obvious to me that he was angry and sadistic even while he was going to pieces.

John Tyler has said that he wishes that, instead of accusing other people of persecuting him, Jac would just come out and say openly that he hates them. Well, Tim induced Jac to do it.

I'll share with you the salient parts. Jac said, 'You are surely too clever to have misread my piece, so you must have chosen to misrepresent it. The question is, why. If you have something to say about where I stand politically, then have the balls to say it openly.'

He went on: 'I hate socialism; I hate the Labour party; but perhaps most of all I hate 'nationalists' for whom Labour is their next favourite team.'

I shared this with my partner. He said, ''Well, who does he like, then?'' The answer must be, 'Very few people indeed.'

Not only does he hate Serbs who 'pretend' to be English and the English arsehole who lives next door. He hates perhaps the majority of Welsh nationalists and certainly all those Welsh people who are not nationalists.
Don't even ask how he feels about Maoris and Jamaicans.

With admirable self restraint, Tim replied, 'Additional unsubstantiated assertions, accompanied by not quite accurate ( to express it diplomatically) personal abuse, are in effect an admission of a lost argument. At best, we should have to agree to differ. The present exchange is now at an end. Hwyl fawr am y tro!'

But Jac had not finished. He lurched back onstage to state,' Listen Tim, I didn't mean to back back [sic] here, son, but it's 2 am and I've had a bottle of Argie Cabernet Sauvignon, so I'm going to say a few things.

'You have used terms here like 'Verb Sap', 'You must advance evidence'...'It is patient of the view'...'duffers currently folding currency...These are silly expressions I wouldn't use even if I was being facetious, or humorous. Telling me that you are a precious, over-wrought, self-regarding little man.

'As for believing that the 'Welsh' Assembly would be improved by the addition of an anti-Welsh bastard like Bryant tells me you are more concerned with - what you perceive to be - the future of mynation [sic]. (The 'my' was italicised.)My nation takes precedence over all.'

My partner commented, ''Wow! He really knows how to get on with people doesn't he?''

What can one say, even taking into account that this was drink fuelled? Freudian psychology is seen as a lot of nonsense these days but it did have just a few valuable insights. It's spot on with projection in Jac's case.

'Precious, over-wrought and self-regarding'. It's such an accurate description of himself that it is like witchcraft. How narcissistic can you get? He identifies himself with Wales as Hitler identified himself with Germany and Stalin did with Russia.

As for the 'weepy narcissistic self pity', he should apply to be an honorary Serb! Note that Jac doesn't even in theory accept that he should adduce evidence to support his statements. Indeed, he thinks it is a 'silly' idiosyncratic quirk of Tim's.

So he is guarded against reality checks. When I first saw this, I was quite distressed for Tim. I urged him to take nothing Jac said literally.

I said he was just externalising issues he had about paranoia and hatred. His thoughts were only of interest from a psychiatric point of view.

I'm surprised Tim allowed this past moderation. Phil Parry hasn't considered it. He sees Jac as a malefactor who is responsible for his actions. But he has described him as pathetic.

Perhaps the most wearing thing is that Jac has a histrionic meltdown if anyone even mildly disagrees with him. But if he notices that he has upset someone else, he is over the moon. I'm thinking of his headline: 'OMG! I've upset the progressives!'

My advice is don't try to communicate directly with him at all. If you're sufficiently concerned about something, discuss it with the police.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:41 am    Post subject: extremsits Reply with quote

I certainly don't go along with everything the psychologist Robin Skynner said in his discussions with John Cleese in the 80s. But perhaps he was on the right track when he said, 'Political extremism is indistinguishable from paranoia. It is paranoia.'

Bobby Kennedy said, ''What is objectionable, what is dangerous about extremists is not that they are extreme, but that they are intolerant. The evil is not what they say about their cause but what they say about their opponents.''
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dai



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seven posts in twenty four hours and on one subject and as ever a good read all the way through - I very much enjoyed that : you make Mondays bearable Marianne !

After writing this I decided to paste it into this thread too - http://repwblic.informe.com/viewtopic.php?p=3041#3041

I liked your point above about the difference between extremism and intolerance ... but would you agree to extend it a bit more ? ... Surely it is The Democrats in Wales and Westminster who extol themselves to The People in Wales and The World as models of " moderation " who promote intolerance - despite all of their speeches against it, or rather because of their speeches against it : they make a point of promoting divisions in society - by class on The Left and by nation on The Right - because they need to deepen and harden these divisions to in order to get themselves elected ... Surely the very reason why Republicans in Wales and The World are vigorously denounced as " extremists " is because the natural political impulse of Republicanism is always towards reconciliation and unity, which Democrats can not subscribe to because they always have to set The People at each other's throats in order to get themselves the votes ...

... Hence The Democrats in Wales are always a clear and present danger to The People in Wales when The People in England are being taught by The Democrats in England to act as they are told, consume what they are told, emote as they are told - and think what they are told, which is nothing more than to be told to act as they are told : thus what The Democrats in Wales and The World really mean by " moderation " is " an unquestioning obedience which is agreeable to those in our party ( - but those who are unquestioningly obedient to another party are extremists - ) " and it is the resulting tribalism which then destroys the political discourse because The Democrats both refuse to engage in it themselves and actively discourage those they claim as their members and supporters from engaging in it lest they begin to obtain a better understanding and sympathy for others, and then - realising that others are not potential opponents but potential collaborators - reject The Ultraism of Democracy for The Altruism of Republicanism ... start to clearly identify the non-political nature of The United Kingdom : that those shouting and screaming that its Republican critics should be jailed are the very ones whose interests it most serves - " The Demockerats in Wales and Westminster." ...

... Whether or not the person that I am talking to is a Republican in Wales or something else in The World, I do not believe that Republicans and Democrats are merely to be mutually regarded as relatively extremist in each others eyes : Republicans are always moderates but appear to be extremists in the eyes of Democrats because Democracy is a non-political system and therefore an amoral, unethical system in which any decision not made upon the grounds of private interest but debated in terms of The Public Interest is automatically denounced as extremist because it those making it are resistant to bribes and threats ... In a truly political system i.e. a Republican political system it would immediately become obvious that The Democrats in Wales and Westminster are subverting the Res Publica and are therefore The Enemies of The People : there has been no clearer example of The Democrats in Wales practising this kind of subversion than in the way in which the have contrived to acquire law-making powers without the hindrance of having a national court in which to be held account to by The People in Wales and The World ... call it childish if you want, that The Welsh Nation's grasp of political education is so infantile that this happened, but do not mistake that it was The Democrats in Wales who did it - and therefore as Republicans and adults we should hold them to be both fully accountable - and responsible - and culpable ...

... Do you realise that I have wandered off-message here ... What I was thinking of saying was that ... um ... When I talk to extremists - and here I mean real extremists, not merely those who have not voted for The Democrats denouncing them - REAL EXTREMISTS ... real extremists have usually arrived at their beliefs after a lot of listening, reading, thinking and arguments - and so, having a lot of knowledge about how others think, extremists are usually very tolerant and sociable people who enjoy talking about both their own beliefs and listening to other people talk about their beliefs ... and when you get onto the subject of politics you find that most extremists are Republicans of some sort because this tolerant behaviour naturally leads towards Republican sentiments ... contrast Democrats : they announce that they are " moderates " yet it turns out that what this means is that they have never considered why they believe in anything, mostly because they are very anxious about thinking at all lest those who rule them punish them for expressing any difference : best to keep quiet, and not socialise with anybody either because those who rule them are very jealous ...

... because if you mention the subject of politics you will find that all " moderate " people like these believe that those who differ from the opinions which they have been given and have not had to test because these opinions entitle those who hold them to enter a ballot paper in the free ( they are told ) National Lottery ( they never win anything - but they have been promised that they might ) and ... entitles them to hate and despise all of those stupid people who keep on insisting that The National Lottery is rigged and that The National Assembly is not to be treated as a casino and ... well all of The People in Wales who are " moderate " and therefore loudly declare themselves to be The Silent Majority surely think that those who do not want to endorse their non-political system The United Kingdom should be harassed and made to sign their name to it - or, if they refuse - fined, jailed, hanged, burnt at the stake ... and then the supporters of the non-political system called The United Kingdom can just sweep the ashes of anybody who threatens to be rational and reasonable into the gutter - and then forge their signatures ... after all, they need all of the corpses that they can get - to prop up their non-political system.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:32 am    Post subject: how Not to Save the dear Mamiaith Reply with quote

In my humble opinion, Jac's attempts to save our dear heniaith by a campaign of intimidation against its opponents is misconceived. He is only strengthening any negative connotations it has for them. They will associate it with small time terrorists who are uncultured and unstable.

Sadly, the language is also badly served by would be supporters whose personality flaws are less in your face. I've been attending a Welsh reading group on Thursdays in Abergavenny Library.

They are run by a Jan Richards. She's a really good, encouraging teacher. She will correct your mistakes but doesn't make you feel small.

I only really appreciate her now that I have experienced an example of how not to run a Welsh course. People told me that a 'Clwb Clonc' course was to be held fortnightly in a certain Olde Worlde pub in the town. This was like manna from heaven as the town is frustratingly anglicised.

I went eagerly. My partner attended some of the meetings.

It was supposed to be for informal conversation but it anyone could be said to be running the group it was a young woman I will refer to as Nansi.Her qualifications for doing so are that she took a three year degree course in Welsh at Aberystwyth, and she was probably a fluent speaker even before that.

Nothing untoward happened for some time. Some weeks ago I suggested that apart from having masculine and feminine genders, Welsh could perhaps be said to have common gender as 'plentyn' for instance mutated differently depending on the child's sex.

Nansi looked at me with distaste as she put me right as she saw it. She informed me from her Olympian height that 'plentyn' which means 'child' is always masculine. I had some doubts about this but wasn't confident of my position.

Trying to keep us both on an even keel of dispassionate academic discourse, I said, ''Oh so it's like German where 'kind' -child- is grammatically neuter although it doesn't represent reality?''

''No, there's no neuter gender in Welsh!'' she said as her face contorted in disgust. She spoke to me as if I was a backward toddler, and she was an adult with an extremely unenlightened attitude to backward toddlers.

This was all the more frustrating as it was she who had made a basic and daft mistake.I was just amazed that she could have misunderstood my meaning so fundamentally.

I don't know if this was because I am a poor communicator. Or maybe it says anything about her intellect.

Keeping calm and rational at all costs, I explained that I had never for one moment imagined that Welsh had a neuter gender. I was making an analogy.

Some mature ladies had just joined up as learners. One looked at me with sympathy, and said, ''I understood what you meant!''

According to an ex-Yugolav stand up comedian, he has the same frustration all the time. He was born in Montenegro, grew up in Serbia, went to university in Bosnia, and now lives in Slovenia.

Making an analogy for people he meets in the UK, he says it's as if he was born in Wales - a small place - grew up in England, the dominant UK country, went to university in Northen Ireland -the bang bang country - and now lives in Scotland.

They look at him vacantly and say, ''Why do you want to live in Scotland?'' Again, a guy who went to Quaker meetings wanted to be a 'real' traditional Ouaker. He decided to call everyone 'thee' and 'thou' but he didn't know when to say 'thee' and when to say 'thou.'

I didn't think he would be familiar with terms like 'accusative' so I said, ''Well, you say' thou' where you would say 'he' and you say' thee' where 'you would say 'him'.'' ''Oh, so thee really means him?'' he replied without a hint of irony.

While I was annoyed and upset, I decided to miss one meeting and then give her another chance. After all, if you stop associating with everyone who has offended you once, you wouldn't be speaking to anyone.

So I attended again this Monday evening. The subject turned to other Celtic languages. I opined that Irish, Gaelic and Manx were not extremely closely related to Welsh compared to Breton and Cornish,

Nansi again had to put me right. Well OK, closeness is relative. I remarked that while there wre obvious similarities, one group were known as P Celtic and the other as Q Celtic.

Nansi kindly let me know that that was so insofar as 'ap' was our equivalent of 'mac'. I eagerly offered other examples as in the words for head where one group has a 'p' sound and the other a 'c' sound.

Also, the word 'clan' is cognate with the Welsh 'plant'meaning children. Although 'clan' is used to mean a large extended family, it literally means 'children.'

Nansi's face contorted with some negative emotions as she trampled all over me,a rubbishing that idea. For the second time, she treated me like a backward toddler, and humiliated me in front of everyone.

I couldn't believe it had happened a second time. I stuck to my guns, saying ''Oh yes it !, while saying it wasn't important, and there was no need to get emotional about it.

I would be the first to admit that Nansi is a fluent speaker of Welsh, and I am nowhere near her level. On the other hand, I too have a degree which involved studying how languages evolve.

Without being a great practical linguist, I do have some knowledge of cpmparative linguistics. I have also had illuminating conversations with people like Tim Saunders and Dafydd ap Geler Thomas who have a high level of expertise in this area.

Perhaps the elephant in the room is that I am an annoying show off. But even if that is so, the mature response would be to say ''Oh really! How interesting! I didn't know that. Your company is so educational!'' in iroinic tones, conveying the message that I was a bore and a pedant who should be redeployed as a draught excluder.

It cannot have been right to shout me down, claiming I was factually incorrect, when she simply didn't know if I was or not.

I thought it would look silly to storm out so I gritted my teeth and endured for the rest of the session. Unfortunately, a young barman came to say the room was wanted for a conference and we would have to move to a small dining room.

I sat facing Nansi over the dining table. I didn't feel up to saying anything. She had really put me off.

I picked up my Welsh-English dictionary and flicked through it for the rest of the evening until the first person suggested it was time for him to leave, giving me an opportunity to say with alacrity that I would go too

This was a counter productive experience to say the least. The whole point of the session was to develop one's confidence and linguistic skills.

After a lot of thought, I decided never to go back as it wasn't doing me any good. But it seemed that it was only I that was evoking this negative reaction in Nansi. She didn't treat anyone else like this.

I couldn't complain officially as it would perhaps be a bit petty. Also, it might lead to the local Clwb Clonc closing down.

I saw myself as a friend of the language, not its enemy. I couldn't be responsible for that.

A friend said, ''Couldn't you find a place in a book to show her that you were right?'' I said, ''It would look like one-upmanship, and the real issue here is about personalities.''

As with Jac, I'm always prepared to accept some responsibility, and I'm sure my demeanour can indeed be irritating.

But that's not entirely the point. I assumed it was something to do with me as Nansi didn't seem to treat anyone else with conspicuous disrespect.

By the way, I don't mind being politely put right when I really have made a mistake but to be humiliated and bullied when I haven't is intolerable.

To my surprise, my partner said that he had had the impression that she was emotionally immature. He said, ''She's not the right person for the job.''He said, ''She wouldn't be tolerant or understanding.''

The one positive thing was that as I was flicking through my dictionary, I overheard people singing the praises of something called 'Bilingo', a scheme for bilingual education that was invented in Cologne.It is now popular in the Spanish speaking world.

It's now popular in Wales too. I must mention that people who are enthusiasts for Welsh, think that Bilingo is great.

It's necessary to state this because Jac o' the North has been busily informing us on the net that Bilingo is an anti-Welsh plot by M15. I checked M15's mission statement, and it has nothing to say on the subject.

Why does Jac think this? Probably, because he's been on the Argie Carbernet Sauvignon again.

Don't ask him for evidence. In his philosophy, only silly, self regarding people require evidence.

This frees him to make any statement at all, however absurd. Unfortunately, by influencing impressionable people to reject Bilingo, he may be bringing what's left of our language and culture crashing down.

And maybe in her humble way, so is Nansi. After all, the numbers of people attending Clwb Clonc have been decimated.

When organising these events, it might be a good idea to have people who have been through a teacher training course or at least a short course in people management.

Fluency is not enough if your personality is all wrong, and you haven't even the ability to put on a professional persona. While I forced myself to behave in a civilized and insouciant way at the time, my repressed feelings caught up with me the next day. I was tense, and also incandescent with rage.

Dwi'm moyn rho'i rhywbeth ble dydy y haul dim yn disgleirio! This is not the relaxrd frame of mind you need to be in to learn how to converse happily and unself- consciously in a second language.

These two incidents are not very important in the great scheme of things. I will soon get over my feelings.

But I can't allow there to be a third time. I can't go back.

And I'm at a loss as to how to respond if someone asks me if they should attend. I have a conflict of interests here.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:24 am    Post subject: It's nice to be nice. Reply with quote

The typos in the above post would have been hard to avoid. Sometimes the spellcheck takes it into its little mind to underline everything in red. This makes it harder to spot the real errors. Does anyone know how to counter this?

I found it a cathartic experience typing the above post. I now feel much better and more detached from the situation.

Unfortunately, we now have a permanent record of my pedantry. I also look like a petty grudge bearer.

Yes, Nansi has flaws, but as Ncky Campbell would say, we're all flawed; we all have fragilities. If you can't tolerate other people's weaknesses, that is a weakness in itself.

I can take a more compassionate and detached stance now. I will have to exercise my compassion for Nansi from a distance as I don't intend to put myself in the firing line again. I'm not that much of a masochist.

And after all, she is not literally a danger to the public which unfortunately Jac is, at least when he is able to influence impressionable people. I think, in his case, the best thing to do is put a sort of cordon sanitaire around him, and not go out of our way to provoke him.

It's like keeping sticks of dynamite well away from the spark that could cause an explosion. It's a damge limitation exercise.

Whether we feel compassion for Jac is irrelevant in practical terms. He wouldn't recognise it anyway. We will have to be watchful, prepared, and hope for the best.
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dai



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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is something about those with a passion to promote Welsh or indeed English or any other language it seems including computer programming languages : it is akin to magical thinking - that they can exercise control over others ... it is also akin to that lazy business of having been born Welsh and therefore already wonderful so why should you bother to achieve anything when everything wonderful has already been achieved by somebody Welsh and therefore you can claim your own part in their wonderfulness because you are Welsh etc - i.e. the difference between claiming that it is the accident of your birth which qualifies you ( which I equate with Nationalism ) and being acclaimed by others for your contribution to society ( which I equate with Patriotism - albeit that there must be a better word for this - and non-sexist, gender neutral one.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodness_Gracious_Me_%28BBC%29 .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tw7LIykvBw

The fact is that it is no great feat nor is it an original contribution to society for us to drink in our mothers' tongues whilst our own lips are wrapped around their tits ... but it is a feat to learn a language which nobody in our families can speak - and it is a contribution to our society when we acquire that skill even if the languages that we learn are obscure to others : surely it can be counted as an act of Matriotism to answer back to our mothers in Klingon or C+ ... it may not be accounted by others to be exactly generally useful - but it is every bit as valid as Early Venodotian Welsh or Middle Anglo-Saxon English, and indeed more popular too ... and when I point out such things to those who use their ability in a language to brow-beat others with they often end up very angry : they regard the use of language in a Hierocratic way, that it endows them with a priestly authority which they enshrine by the use of obscure language - and by the denigration of others for not being as precise in their usage as themselves ... and that has been one of the major causes of the public decline of the use of Welsh : that from the minute that Welsh started to appear on the printed page in the 16c in " Y Beibl " the use of Morgan's choice of words acquired the Hierocratic authority to beat others over the head with them : the struggle to communicate was then replaced by the struggle for power - and - in ceasing to be tools : words became weapons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fQrY1r5OD4 ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkhUivqzWv0

The tricky thing I think is to be able to challenge those abusing words and languages to manipulate others without abusing those using words and languages for their proper purposes. ... To paraphrase George Carlin, we need to assist others to become fully empowered by The Eye - although we are only possessed of a limited vision - in order for us all to resist the blindness of The United Kingdom. ... Oh ... There is that video again - " Stephen Fry on Political Correctness and Clear Thinking "

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJQHakkViPo ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1kzsmI0rrw

Well I liked him : I like listening to how the non-acaemic, non-indoctrinated make sense of things - in our own words ... I liked what he said - but I would like him to talk more loudly ... louds of others to listen to ...
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:19 am    Post subject: Persist Reply with quote

We all enjoyed ourselves in Jan Richards' class in Abergavenny Library last night. There was a real rapport. We were also introduced to her mother.

Jan and Nansi have nothing in common except their job descriptions and presumably a passion for our mother tongue. Nansi's not betraying it on purpose.

It's just that her personality and attitude are all wrong. My partner has reminded me that Nansi is not a native Welshwoman.

She was born in Gloucester but had a sudden yen to go to Aberystwyth to do Welsh. He described her as 'eccentric' which seems to be a euphemism for a bit strange.

It was certainly an unusual decision but I don't think it means that she needs her head examined. I don't like her but if this sudden passion for Welsh was all I knew about her, I would admire her for it.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Tue May 03, 2016 10:12 pm    Post subject: Jac's U turn on Ukip Reply with quote

I was just bewildered about Jac's visceral hatred of Ukip. I would have thought that he had much in common with the party spiritually, and would certainly have voted for it had he lived in England, assuming there was no BNP or EDL candidate locally.

Instead he made no distinction between Ukip and Labour and assumed they had joined forces to persecute him via Phil Parry. He exhausted his invective hoard, spewing out his bile over Nathan Gill whom he believed to be that rarity, a dishonest politician. His true fan base responded ''Well done, Jac!'' or the like.


Those who read his bog for its unintentional comedy value, were gently amused, and ribbed him about it in a not unkind way.

Plaid Cymru would be anxious to distance themselves from the kind of nationalistic sentiment espoused by Ukip. Leanne Wood shot up in public esteem when she told Nigel Farage he ought to be ashamed of himself for his rabble rousing.

He had whipped up fears about AIDS sufferers from abroad, even Eastern Europe, coming here. Leanne objected to his appealing to the worst instincts in humanity ie fear and hatred of the sick.

I don't know if it was this exchange that convinced Jac that in his heart of hearts he was a natural Ukip fan after all. But something has convinced him to do a U turn and pontificate about how Ukip could save Wales.

It will have plenty of chances on Thursday. Nigel Farage hopes to get five Ukip AMs into the Assembly.

If it is not that Ukip shares Jac's fears of those who are carriers of AIDS, chicken pox or have broken nails, it is probably Gareth Bennet's concerns about East Europeans infesting City Road Cardiff that has done the trick.

He thinks they have contributed to the 'hygiene' crisis in this area of Cardiff. At first, I thought this might be by dropping rubbish or not washing their hands thoroughly.

But now I have been granted a flash of insight. Perhaps Gareth - and Jac too for all I know - thinks the East Europeans in City Road, Cathays and Roath actually are rubbish. I'll have to advise my three sons, one of whom does actually have a Mediterranean appearance, not to go anywhere near City Road in Cardiff.

I don't want them to have to pay for the crime of having Serbian and Croatian blood by being picked up and sent off to be resettled in the East. I want them to be treated like human beings and respected as individuals.

Perhaps Jac did briefly make contact with reality in suspecting Nathan Gill wasn't the straightest of regular guys. Gill is aware that most people would be embarrassed to say openly that they support Ukip.

He has reminded the electorate that we have a secret ballot. No one will be looking over your shoulder. You can safely vote Ukip even if you dare not admit it to your closest friend or the lover who lies beside you all night.

Perhaps there is a difference between being secretive and being dishonest. But what an admission this is! That voting Ukip is a dirty little secret.

I hope they won't get a single AM. I had hoped they were finished after the general election last year.

Is Jac a Nashi or a Nazi? There's no difference between the two in his philosophy.

After contemplating his alternative nationalism, I should hope anyone would scuttle back to Leanne's left wing party of Wales as fast as their little legs could carry them.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2016 8:32 am    Post subject: Oh no! Reply with quote

Oh no! As a friend predicted yesterday, Ukip has its first two seats in the Welsh Assembly. Nathan Gill and Michelle Brown have been selected for the North Wales list.

Jac will be rejoicing that Ukip will save Wales. After all, at the general election last year, Ukip not only opposed immigration from Eastern Europe, but wanted the physically different to be put in segregated colonies.

What Jac presumably hopes that Ukip will save Wales from is human and ethnic diversity. Both Jac and Nigel Farage should be in therapy or re-education classes, not influencing the weak minded among the populace.

On a cheerier note, we all had a good laugh in Jan Richards' Welsh literature class last night although the story we read, did inspire her to ask who remembered outside toilets and cane wielding teachers. I'd like to put all those memories behind me.

I can't understand why people feel nostalgic for the past. The good old days were terrible.

Later a lady agreed with me that Jan was a marvellous teacher, and said the teacher of adults at the 'Hill' centre in Abergavenny had been awful, short tempered and unpleasant. After a bit, it occurred to me that this must have been a teacher other than Nansi.

So there are at least two teachers of Welsh for adults in poor old anglicised Abergavenny who have an attitude problem. There is a perception that Welsh speakers have a snobbish attitude to the monoglot English speakers of Wales.It looks as if Dai subscribes to this.

They're certainly not all that bad. Jan makes good teaching look effortless. We only notice how excellent she is, because other people aren't.

I feel like contacting those who promote the teaching of Welsh to adults, to tell them something that ought to be obvious. The teacher msut be friendly and encouraging. Otherwise, you're just putting the hopeful adults off, and driving them away.
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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2016 9:30 am    Post subject: Aaargh! Reply with quote

It looks as if my information is out of date, and Ukip has six seats in the Assembly! Surely, this can't be right? This is like a bad dream.

I rarely agree with Jac, and I'm afraid that they will destroy Wales.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2016 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reckless voting or what? Reply with quote

Our Ukip AMs include the aptly named Mark Reckless and Neil 'Cash for Questions' Hamilton , the former 'disgraced' Tory MP. Yes, I do know Hamilton was born near Blackwood and his first name is Mostyn.

As I am not quite as race conscious as Jac, this does not make me warm to him. What are voters thinking of?

Like the Reichstag in the 20s and early 30s and the Knesset today, the Assembly has proportional representation. This sounds fair and civilized, but it does let crank parties in.

I can't believe this is happening. Nigel Farage and his chums used to march round the school grounds as boys, singing Hitler Youth songs, or so it has been alleged, We have no reason to think that his world view has fundamentally altered now.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2016 8:13 pm    Post subject: Seven up Reply with quote

It's even worse than I thought. Ukip has seven seats in the Assembly.

For a while there was a dead tie between Carwyn Jones and Leanne Wood for first minister. It was quite dramatic.

It would have been great if it had come to a tie breaker, and Leanne had become our beloved leader. But if it had been with the help of Ukip, how could she ever have had any credibility?

I notice that right wing comments on the Spectator message board were pathetic, on the lines of 'Leanne Wood looks like a primary school teacher and has a dead common voice!'

Could the debate become even more vacuous? Would it be possible to lower the tone further?

Yes. Justin Welby, the present archbishop of Canterbury has now castigated Nigel Farage - rightly I expect - for his appealing to the murky depths of the human psyche.

Baroness Saida -or is it Sayeda?- Warsi, Doreen Lawrence, the mother of Stephen and Shami Chakrabarti from 'Liberty' agree.

Mick Antoniw, the AM for Pontypridd says that he has been startled by the views openly expressed by supporters of Brexit. Opinions previously associated with the far right are now common currency. They have almost gone legit.

I think it may have been 19 years since Dale MacPherson told me of the rise of a movement based on the Ku Klux Klan in Pontypridd. We heard of an Iraqi asylum seeker being murdered in a racist attack in the town. It is all the more tragic as he came here to be free of identity based violence.

Mick Antoniw told the 'Western Mail' today that an NHS worker in Pontypridd told him seriously that her son could not get a job because of all the immigrants. She meant the Chinese family who lived across the road and ran a Chinese restaurant!

It's a bit perturbing as we would like to be able to see NHS workers as caring, perhaps even rational, although life should have disabused us of that impression by now. This woman also put it to Mick Antoniw that immigrants should be loaded into the backs of trucks and taken away.

Mick Antoniw remarked that that was what Hitler had done to the Jews. ''So What?'' said the constituent, no doubt proud of her robust opinions. Mr Antoniw was probably feeling a bit dazed by this time.

But at least he would not have been surprised when another local resident told him that he was going to vote Leave so that his children could sleep safely in their beds and not have to worry about being raped by immigrants.

A man in his eighties was wearing a 'Vote Leave' badge today. He told me he was worried about human rights. He didn't like that sort of thing!
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:54 pm    Post subject: We don't want foreign perverts - we prefer our own! Reply with quote

Jac has been savage about English pensioners who might move into delightful cottages in North Wales. He is revolted by their incapacity.

I remarked before that Jac's ideal Wales would be no country for old men, but even I didn't guess how literally accurate that was. I imagine that Jac and his cohorts will be standing outside their desirable residences with banners, chanting, ''Wrinklies Out!''

Jac is so deliciously like Chairman Mao. The cultural revolution was all about sicking the young on the old. It was one of life's little ironies that the red guards didn't even notice that Mao was also a wrinkly old codger!

Phil Parry tells us that Jac is an 'elderly' gentleman, a retired owner of an air conditioning outfit. Even in the picture taken with Cayo in 1969, Jac looks middle aged.

I was then three. I'm now middle aged so Jac must be about a hundred!Surely, he's not trying to distract attention from his own vulnerabilities?

He's a great one for the 'us' and 'them' mentality. According to him, the hard drugs problem in Llanelli is caused by outsiders.

He has no hesitation in labelling the English incomers 'perverts', an accusation that is evidence free as far as we know.

This is just how Farage sees eastern European immigrants.

It's a canard with a long history. The word 'bugger' is derived from 'Bulgarian' although it has also been influenced by the French 'bougre', to shift about.

Jac wrote a warm and admiring piece called 'Cofiwn' after the death of Dafydd y Dug. He was probably well aware that his idol has been accused of raping young boys, and had spent some time in jail.

John Owen, the writer of 'Pam Fi, Duw?', committed suicide in 2001 while awaiting trial for serious sexual offences against kids.

As he was never convicted, I personally would not say the case has been proved against him. But a later inquiry was damning, and found that Welsh language culture was implicated, although only incidentally.

I know for a fact that the Welsh nationalist Boz is a sex offender for I was one of his victims!

I was annoyed when a TV sketch about immigrants in New York, said that the Welsh migrants were the lowest of the low, and the best thing they did was run the city's child prostitution racket. It was supposed to be a joke, but it didn't sound very funny to me.

But we know that we do have home grown perverts. Nigel Farage's British aide is now being investigated for chid sex offences.

Why do Jac and Farage have an insouciant attitude to native perverts, but stir up hatred for foreigners whom they label perverts without evidence ? Is it that we have a better class of pervert?

I don't think so. Farage just hates foreigners. Jac hates the English.

Any accusation will do. They don't care whether people really are perverts or not

To Jac's mind, it is beside the point that some of his best friends and most fervently admired patriots are sex offenders.

Truth, impartiality and relevance are of no interest to him. He's operating on a reflexive emotional level which facts can't reach.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2016 10:49 pm    Post subject: An Act of War Reply with quote

I had thought the Sun had improved as a paper beyond all recognition. But under the stress of waiting for the EU referendum to be decided, it has been referring to immigrants as rats - or so it has been alleged.

This must be some cause for concern when you remember that French colonists habitually called Algerians 'rattans'.

The Nazi film 'The Eternal Jew' showed shabby people wandering round a market, while the voice over said, ''Jews! They're this, they're that and the other, and they come together in large numbers - just like ...RATS!'', as the camera panned to a tremendous horde of rats scurrying along a sewer.

It appealed to the lowest common denominator, but it want harmlessly over the head of my adoptive father when he saw it repeated on TV. He just chuckled, and said, ''Duw, there's a lot of rats!''

The Daily Mail has run a story on the Albanian criminal who lives in the UK and can't be touched by the law for some reason. This is a racist story. If he had been British, his behaviour would not be held to reflect on all Britons.

Yet reality is not black and white. Maybe there is an Albanian Mafia.

I know for a fact that blood feuds persist in the highlands of Albania. Women are held to be exempt, but a male baby can't go out of the house if his family is involved in a blood feud without taking his life into his hands.

It is part of the code of honour that no one will break into the family home with homicidal intent. But the men have to stay inside if they want to see another day.
The women can go to school and work and the shops. Otherwise, the menfolk would be in danger of starving.

Some of these feuds go back decades. Is this a very sensible custom?

We've heard of Italian police having crackdowns on entire Gypsy communities when they received a complaint of one Gypsy committing a sexual offence. If it had been an 'ordinary' Italian, no one but the person concerned would have had any hassle.

The complaint - which had not led to a conviction- just sparked off the not very latent Gitanophobia that the police already harboured. But isn't it possible that some ethnic groups really are more rape prone than others?

Obviously, there may be pockets of historical time when this is true, for instance during the invasion of one country by another. It is then an act of war.

In these cases, the perpetrators will normally have deep racist scorn for the victims, even seeing them as less than human. I met a cheery Welshman called Ivan. He was born in May 1945, and had been named after the first Russian soldier to enter Berlin with the Red Army.

We don't want to think about the details as the Russians were our allies. But we know what they did to civilian German women between intervals of marching round the ruined city, chanting, ''Gitler [sic] kaput! Goebbels kaput! Stalin sehr gut.''

What other circumstances will make one ethnic group a significant sexual threat to another? Strangely enough, it can be when one group does not think the other is sexually circumspect enough.

Certain British Asian men refer contemptuously to 'white slags', before discussing appreciatively which ones they prefer.

I've heard brown pre-teen Muslim girls clucking about older white women who go out with bare legs and arms and midriffs. They lamented, ''They don't know what modesty means!''

You don't have to be brown or a Muslim to feel like this. Richard Littlejohn in a column was having a meltdown about woman who thought they had a 'right to dress like whores and be treated like nuns.' Presumably, this tosser thinks he has a right to go up and molest strangers in the street.

I was just confused when I heard my real parents, who live in the North of England, complaining about 'Asians' preying on white girls 'who ought to be in school.' This was before the Rotherham story came out. It's certainly not just Rotherham that is affected.

Apparently, one reason why the local authorities failed to protect anyone was just because of their own so-called 'anti-racist' agenda. The Asian sex rings were, of course, predicated on racism and sexism. But anti-white racism is not always taken seriously.

Yasmin Alibhai_Brown noted that the story was more nuanced than it might seem at first sight. It was not that no one at all in the sex rings was white.

She said rightly that some British people feel that it is an abomination to be raped by a foreigner, but white British rapists are more acceptable. Presumably, they had better manners.

She then appeared to go some way towards accepting that this might be true. She quoted a white girl who had been abused by her own father who would cry afterwards. On the whole she hated that less than being abused by 'Ahmed' who ran a child sex ring in Derby.

Ahmed said it was her own fault. She had tempted him with her infidel wiles. If she had not been an unbeliever, he would never have done it.

It's a bit strange that the authorities did not notice the 100 mixed race babies born to underage white girls in the area, or that so many underage white girls were being admitted to hospital with miscarriages or for abortions. But you can ignore anything if you are sufficiently determined to do it.

Shortly after devolution, the West Indian journalist Darcus Howe toured England to find out if there was a specifically English as opposed to British identity. He found that in port towns on the south coast, the locals told him their English identity was under threat from the Serbs and Croats who went round molesting women.

I expected my half Croatian, half Serbian husband to take offence. Instead he said, ''Well, they probably do go around molesting women because these Serbs and Croats - they are such peasants!''

In my experience, the main danger a male Serb or Croat poses to you if you are a woman is talking to you as if you were a parrot. His courtship technique involves stroking your chin while making remarks analogous to ''Who's a pretty boy, then?''

It's true my husband upset quite a few female teachers and librarians with his rude and confrontational manner, although he never posed a sexual threat to them. A retired teacher did a survey for me.

We had a long conversation. She asked me in all seriousness if women were allowed to be teachers in Serbia. The Serbian refugee fathers of the kids in her school had all exhibited challenging behaviour and resented her authority, such as it was.

A lawyer I had a discussion with confirmed that the Balkans 'have a very male dominated society,' So yes, some cultures may produce men who are especially prone to being rude to women or to people in general.

We don't have to respect their culture in a case like this. We should tell them off.

Sometimes they may even pose a statistically greater sexual threat than the nationals of other countries. But we should have the same standards for everyone. It doesn't make sense to say it's ok to be a sex offender if you're a Welsh nationalist and a friend of Jac o' the North!





,[/u]
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:31 pm    Post subject: Unbelievable Reply with quote

Spitting Image had a sketch about the European parliamentary elections in the 80s. The politician puppets sat in a TV studio waiting for the public to phone in. They began to hum to themselves and drum their fingers.

The point was no one could be bothered to phone in. The European Union was a soporific like watching Testcard. No one could be arsed about it. Another sketch was based on the idea that even MEPS themselves didn't know Brussels from Strasbourg.

No one could say there's been a lack of interest in the build up to the EU referendum. But it hasn't been a civilised or cerebral debate. It's brought out the worst in people, their basest animal instincts.

And however much the Freuds have fallen from grace, I have to use Siggy's overworked concept of projection. The right wing press have stirred up fear and hatred of lorry loads of immigrants from Nova Zembla or some such far off savage land, with the headline, 'Let us in. We are from Europe.'

People have had the impression that the barbarians are literally at the gates, that our civilization and way of life are at stake. We had to fight for the decent values that define Britain.

Let's take Jac's bete noir Serbia as an example. They did horrible things to old people in the 1990s war - oh no, never mind about old people. Elder abuse is as British as Branston pickle, and even Jac has a leaning towards it.

OK, their history has been punctuated by genocide. They also have no respect for women.

Although women couldn't gain power through the ballot box until recently, some women came to political prominence through royal connections even a century ago. And how have the Serbs treated them?

Gavrilo Princip may have shot Sophie, the morganatic wife of Archduke Franz Ferdinand in error, but what about Empress Elisabeth - 'Sisi' - of Austria who was assassinated at the turn of the twentieth century? OK, the Austrian empire took in Croatia but not Serbia, and the assassin probably wasn't a Serb.

But for a sickening account of animalistic barbarity, just turn to 'Black Lamb and Grey Falcon.' In 1903, a mob broke into the royal palace in Belgrade. Queen Draga and her husband Alexander hid in a cupboard.

It was like a macabre game of hide and seek. The mob rampaged around looking for them. They were 'cold, then hot, then red hot.' They dragged them out of the cupboard.

It wasn't so much an assassination as a lynching. The frenzied horde literally cut them up into small pieces with their swords, and threw the bloodied clumps of flesh to a crowd outside the palace railings.

While working on BLGF, Rebecca West was overcome by the strangeness of seeing a mosque with snow on its domed roof. Where would you see that but in Yugoslavia? It would be no strange sight now.

Douglas Murray said that the fault line between the stable Christian west and the Islamic east from which anything can be expected, used to run through Sarajevo. Now it runs though any cobbled street in a northern mill town.

It's true. A Pollyanna-ish Yorkshire lass believed that there was something to be gained from treating this flotsam and jetsam as if they were reasonable creatures. She was nice if naïve.

Herself a mother of two tiny children, she thought it was a good idea to let in child migrants from Syria. She wanted to be welcoming to immigrants from outlandish foreign parts.

She simply had no idea of the savagery she was dealing with. She entered parliament with last year's crop of new MPs. Yesterday, she attended her surgery in Yorkshire as usual.

A crazed male person surged forward, firing bullets at her from an illegally held weapon. After she had been felled, he shot her again in the head. Not satisfied with that, he stabbed her repeatedly with a foot long knife and kicked her as she lay on the pavement.

It was hardly clinical and distanced enough to be classified as a political assassination. It was more frenzied, more brutal, almost like a lynching. It was Queen Draga all over again.

It was also uncannily like the shooting and stabbing of Theo Van Gogh by a crazed Islamist in Amsterdam.

So what were the national origins of this barbarous untermensch who brought savagery to our tight little island, from which we are still reeling in disbelief?

He was a white Yorkshireman, and some eyewitnesses say he was chanting patriotically, ''Britain First!'' as he lunged at the personable diminutive MP.

We have looked into the heart of darkness, and behold, we have seen ourselves reflected in its jetty depths. You don't have to go as far as Sarajevo or Belgrade to find uncontrolled savages.

It's like Asne Seierstad or somebody said about Anders Breivik. He was one of us.
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