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Moritz



Joined: 10 Mar 2014
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ulster Peace is ticking over OK touch wood.

given thesis #1 = Tory Blur is evil incarnate, the obvious xplanation is Blur succeeded in achieving mass murder and genocide in Iraq and Yugoslavia; he failed to achieve genocide in Ulster. Nobody's perfect xcept Blur's imam.

given thesis #2 = Tory Blur is Good incarnate, the obvious xplanation is Blur failed to stop mass murder and genocide in Iraq and Yugoslavia; he succeeded by stopping genocide in Ulster. Nobody's perfect xcept Blur's imam.

Tory Blur war criminal?

Iraq was the legalist war evah.

Parliament voted for that war.

WWII was Neville Chamberlain: "I have in my hand a piece of paper. It is a Declaration of War versus Germany signed by the Prime Minister of England."

In those days, the Law was that Prime Minister himself, on his own recognisances could declare War on behalf of everybody in the whole World. The better Law is that Parliament writes the Declaration. The bestest Law would turn Lying to Parliament into the felony of Treason.

Under current Law, Blur is innocent. This proves that Law is retarded.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:05 am    Post subject: from Blair to Bastille Reply with quote

Parliamentary privilege means you can't be sued or prosecuted for what you say in the House, just as a barrister has privilege in court. You can't be sued for calling someone a murderer after they have been acquitted.

You will remember, though, that John Profumo had to resign in 1963 after lying to the house about a trivial thing ie that he was having an affair. The only thing that lifted it out of the realm of tabloid gossip was that his girlfriend was also shagging the Soviet attache during the Cold War.

The relevant little ditty was:

''Oh what have you done?'' cried Christine
''You've wrecked the party machine!
To lie in the nude may be terribly rude
But to lie in the house is obscene!''

Neville Chamberlain began his lugubrious speech about how we were now at war with Germany by telling us, ''I am speaking to you from the cabinet room at Number 10 Downing Street.'' You had the impression he was alone, and had not just been discussing the subject with cabinet insiders.

Parliament had been recalled in August, though, to discuss the crisis as Germany prepared to invade Poland. It now looks as if we should have made a pre-emptive strike to prevent them getting into Poland, not declared war after they had already overrun the country, and then done nothing for the eight months of the phoney war.

I'd been thinking we should have gone in at the time Germany invaded Czechoslovakia. But an old lady who could remember those times told me that we were not prepared for war in 1938. Whether or not the prime minister can declare war on his own personal whim, it doesn't sound like a good idea to do it.

The fact is Blair didn't have the backing of the UN. Whether it was illegal or not, he's done enough harm in the area. He's replaced one Saddam Hussein with lots of little Saddam Husseins.

He's either a knowingly guilty malefactor or he was unbelievably incompetent. How can anyone argue that he had no mens rea at all? He must have had some idea of what he was doing.

That he got it all wrong by mistake through refusing to listen suggests that he has a personality disorder. Somebody did describe trying to explain the difficulties and imponderables to him. Apparently, Blair replied, ''But he [Saddam] is evil, right?''

That's disastrously simplistic thinking. It's advisable not to think of your opponent as totally evil, even if they are. Experience shows that this disinhibits you to such an extent that you think it's acceptable to use any methods in you fight against them.

Before you know it, it is you who are being labelled evil and even a war criminal, and with good reason. We can't trace a straight line from the invasion of Iraq to today, so I won't say that Blair has some indirect responsibility for the latest atrocity, but people less kind than myself might do so.

I really thought a truck had mounted the pavement and killed or injured some Bastille Day revellers in Nice by accident. But of course, it wasn't that.

We know how Al Qaeda and IS have it in for France of all European countries.
And of course they especially hate the values of the Revolution, 'Liberty, Equality, Fraternity.' How many placards have we seen on Islamist marches, demanding, 'Freedom, go to Hell'?

When you consider what a lighthearted, joyful occasion Bastille Day usually is, with the kids off school and everyone dancing in the streets into the small hours, this attack looks especially contemptible, an attack on happiness, an attack on the principles of a modern civil society, an attempt to destroy as many human lives as a truck full of hand grenades can manage.

We've seen images of Tintin weeping for the children. Now it will be my avatar Marianne weeping for the children. And it won't even be the first time. We saw Marianne bowed and holding her head in her hands after the Charlie Hebdo massacre.
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Moritz



Joined: 10 Mar 2014
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

I'd been thinking we should have gone in at the time Germany invaded Czechoslovakia. But an old lady who could remember those times told me that we were not prepared for war in 1938. Whether or not the prime minister can declare war on his own personal whim, it doesn't sound like a good idea to do it.
Indeed. Piece of Paper defined Sudetenland to include Krupps weapons Factories in the German zone. Very conwenient.

Piece of Paper handed over to the Nazis, the line of fortresses built by the Czechs on the Chekh/ German border. Hitler's generals reported that that line of fortresses was impregnable. Diplomacy = war by other means.

Not ready for War???

When UK eventually did declare war, we just faffed around for months.
We could have declared war to defend Chekhoslovakia and faffed around while regiments of Nazis died throwing themselves against the impregnable line of forts which was supplied from the Krupps weapons Factories

Ching!!! Profit!
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dai



Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marianne said " When you consider what a lighthearted, joyful occasion Bastille Day usually is, with the kids off school and everyone dancing in the streets into the small hours, this attack looks especially contemptible, an attack on happiness, an attack on the principles of a modern civil society, an attempt to destroy as many human lives as a truck full of hand grenades can manage. "

Those sentiments strike home and very deep for me - but there are two Bastille Days in France : the " unofficial " one with picnics and conversations and fireworks which we want to celebrate, and the " official " one with tanks and planes and uniforms marching past ... that being said ... it is worth noting that the French seem to make a point of the idea of defence rather than offence and so all sorts of uniformed services make their appearance not just soldiers, sailors and airmen ... I turned to the news at midnight and the story in Nice was just breaking and I followed it for an hour - gobsmacked ... according to the BBC News the following morning an American had been killed ... they had searched for eight hours to find somebody British amongst the corpses but in the end they had to settle for somebody who could barely speak English - oh ! - and a childs' fluffy toy got run over too ... that they had to use as a substitute for the fluffy pet animal ... oh - and some foreigners got squashed too ... possibly French ones ... probably immigrants ... Actually one of those interviewed was an English Member of Parliament - and that interested me : when we go out and celebrate the birthday of The Republicanism in Europe on a budget with sandwiches and sodas sitting in the park - as The People in France do - we are at best treated as insane or worse - criminals ... or worst, criminally insane ... but if we were wealthy and jetted off to Nice to stay in a posh hotel and watch the fireworks over the Med ... well the BBC would interview us in hushed tones of hallowed respect for participating in " The Festival of Freedom " - YEAH : the BBC actually called " The 14th July " that when describing it for their audience this time ... of course in France nobody knows what you mean if you call it " Bastille Day " because it is " La Fête Nationale."

http://www.frenchtoday.com/blog/le-14-juillet-la-fete-nationale-francaise-bastille-day

BTW - care to add your thoughts ? - http://repwblic.informe.com/viewtopic.php?p=3698#3698


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marianneh



Joined: 30 May 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:18 pm    Post subject: bridge over Bosphorous closed Reply with quote

Events are running away with us. I've just turned to BBC News Channel in the hope of getting more news on the Bastille Day Massacre - we've heard the sole terrorist was deliberately targeting children and fifty injured are between life and death - and now I find this is not even the main item on the news!

I was extremely impressed a few days ago when I met a youngish lecturer in American Literature at Istanbul University, and not because he was a narcissistic charmer like many lecturers but because he was a really nice and sensible person, knowledgeable without being pretentious. He is the son of a friend in Abergavenny.

I just hope he's ok. He has gone back to Istanbul. Now the military have staged a coup, and there are explosions both in Istanbul and Ankara. It's not now possible to cross the Bosphorous by bridge - or any other way. A government spokesman has denied that it is a real coup, but it obviously is.
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dai



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that this coup in Turkey may be an example of that illusory " freedom " which Billy Bragg refers to as " merely privilege extended - unless enjoyed by all " - that the military have once more taken away what they occasionally dole out on the end of a length of very elastic legislation ... I keep listening to various renditions of his revised version of " The Internationale " - here is him telling how he came to re-write it -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BIvqbyku5g - Billy Bragg - Internationale

( I still find his singing painful though - nearly as bad as mine ! )

This turned up besides that ... Putin was talking of World War Three and we have appointed Boris as Foreign Secretary ? - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMMscY7Btus

Hell - Putin has declared war on that as well ? - Putin Declares War On The Luciferians - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CVc6j4uDow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FIgnnrzJzk - Lucifer is Jesus ...

Face To Face With LUCIFER !!! - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He9H500yGZA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHAOnMeZNOI - THE WIFE OF LUCIFER CONFESSES HER PAST

EXPOSED !!! Lucifer is the god of the Illuminati
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRdD8TrYZnM

... ahem ... belonging to The Illuminati ourselves we all know that none of us are capable of organising our bookshelves - so how are we supposed to organise these revolutions ?

Personally - I blame their governments ...

21:45 - The Turkish military issued a statement saying it had taken over power. The statement said it had done so to preserve democratic order, and that the rule of law must remain a priority. Exactly which bit of the Turkish military was speaking was unclear.

21:57 - Mr Yildirim ( Turkish PM ) said the security forces had been called in to deal with the situation, and that Turkey would never allow any "initiative that would interrupt democracy". "There was an illegal act by a group within the military that was acting out of the chain of military command," he said, warning that those responsible would pay the highest price.

22:15 - A statement has been out on state television. It is not clear who the statement was by, amid reports that the army chief was being held.

22:15 - Continuing to read the military's statement, the TRT announcer says Turkey's democratic and secular rule of law has been eroded by the current government, Reuters reports. The country is now run by a "peace council" that will ensure the safety of the population, the announcer adds. A new constitution will be prepared "as soon as possible".

22:26 - President Recep Tayyip Erdogan and his government are still in power and will not tolerate attempts to undermine democracy, a presidential source tells the Reuters news agency.

22:35 - A European Union source tells the Reuters news agency: "It looks like a relatively well orchestrated coup by a substantial body of the military, not just a few colonels." "They control several strategic points in Istanbul. Given the scale of the operation, it is difficult to imagine they will stop short of prevailing," the source adds.

[ ONE OF THESE NEWS FLASHES SAYS SOMETHING LIKE THE PEOPLE ARE EMBRACING THEIR NEW FOUND FREEDOM BY IGNORING RED TRAFFIC LIGHTS ]

[ GULEN ARE BEING BLAMED BY THE GOVERNMENT BUT THEY HAVE DENIED ANY INVOLVEMENT - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%BClen_movement ]


[ LATEST - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-36811357 ]

01.43 - Police chief: '104 soldiers involved in coup attempt' - Jon Williams, Managing Editor of International News at ABC News, tweets: Istanbul Police Chief says only 104 soldiers involved in #TurkeyCoup. Leader named as Col Muharrem Kose, recently dismissed as Gulen member.

01.50 - Soldiers take CNN Turk off air - A group of soldiers has entered the Istanbul premises of Turkey's private media group Dogan Media and cut the live broadcast of its CNN-Turk TV channel.

[ ONE MORE COFFEE - AND THE BBC WORLD SERVICE NEWS AT 02.00 I THINK ]

02.01 - Coup attempt defeated - Turkish intelligence agency - A spokesman for Turkey's national intelligence agency, MIT, says the coup attempt has been defeated but that there are some pockets of resistance. "People are marching on these groups. All people who have taken part in this attempt will stand trial for treason. There is no problem for the time being," Nuh Yilmaz is quoted as saying by the Hurriyet website.

[ I ACTUALLY SWITCHED ON THE TV TO WATCH BBC NEWS - AND I WAS SPECULATING THAT THIS MIGHT BE A GOOD EXAMPLE OF HOW A CAREFUL BALANCE BETWEEN THE POLICE - IN THIS INSTANCE A SORT OF GENDARMERIE ARMED WITH SIMPLE LIGHT WEAPONS AND IN LARGE NUMBERS - AND THE MILITARY - IN THIS INSTANCE ARMED WITH SOPHISTICATED HEAVY WEAPONS BUT IN SMALL NUMBERS - CAN PREVENT A COUP ... BUT IN THIS INSTANCE THERE WERE HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE - A RELATIVELY SMALL NUMBER REALLY - WHO WERE STOOD IN FRONT OF THE TANKS AND FACING DOWN SOLDIERS WHO WERE FIRING OVER THEIR HEADS ... IT WAS CHILLING TO WATCH THEIR HOT PASSION TO DEFEAT THIS COUP LEAD THEM TO CHALLENGE SOLDIERS TO ADVANCE OVER THEIR DEAD BODIES ... THEY OUGHT TO HAVE DONE A " TURNING THE TIDE " COURSE FIRST I THINK ... TO LEARN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN COURAGE AND STUPIDITY ? ]

http://turningtide.org.uk/

“The difference between courage and stupidity is measured by success and survival.”

Evan C. Currie - The Heart of Matter


http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/1301895-the-difference-between-courage-and-stupidity-is-measured-by-success

[ I READ A NUMBER OF OPINIONS ABOUT COURAGE V STUPIDITY AND GAVE IT SOME MORE THOUGHT ... I THINK THAT THE DIFFERENCE ACTUALLY LIES IN THE OPINIONS OF OTHERS ... ANY PERSON CAUGHT UP IN AN ACTION IS NOT THINKING ABOUT EITHER - OR IF THEY ARE THEY ARE THEY ARE DISADVANTAGING THEMSELVES BY NOT ATTENDING TO WHAT THEY ARE DOING ... OTHER PEOPLE MAY THINK THAT A PERSON BEING FLATTENED BY A TANK IS STUPID HAVING ACHIEVED NOTHING BY IT BUT THEIR DEATH ... BUT TO THE PERSON WHO CHOOSES TO DIE THIS WAY IT MAY BE HIGHLY MEANINGFUL ... I AM TRYING TO MAKE HERE THE POINT MADE IN " IF " - THAT WE MUST DO THE RIGHT THING ALWAYS AND BE INDIFFERENT TO THE CONSEQUENCES : IF WE DO NOT DO THE RIGHT THING THEN THE OVERALL SUM OF THE HARMFUL CONSEQUENCES FOR EVERYBODY OF OUR INDIVIDUALLY DOING THE WRONG THING IS SIGNIFICANTLY MORE THAN THE HARMFUL CONSEQUENCES FOR US.]

[ THAT MAKES ME SOUND LIKE A SAINT OR A MARTYR ... WELL : I AM CERTAINLY NO SAINT - SO I GUESS THAT AS A SINNER I AM DUTY BOUND TO BE A MARTYR.]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If%E2%80%94

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TPVtl6Xoew

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJQPFmictmo

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36813543

04.00 am & I need to know : I used to befriend prisoners of the Turkish military regime of the 1980s - people who were tortured, one of whom eventually managed to emigrate.

02.30 - 'Millions in the streets' - Turkey's president says millions are on the streets, protesting against the attempted coup

03.16 - Turkish PM: Shoot down coup aircraft - Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim has ordered the military to shoot down any aircraft hijacked by coup plotters. - He says military jets have taken off from an air base in Eskisehir, east of Ankara.

03.41 - 42 dead in Ankara - report - A spokesman in a prosecutor's office says at least 42 people have been killed in Ankara, the Turkish capital - including 17 police officers.

03.44 - Soldiers arrested at presidential palace - Reuters is now quoting a senior Turkish official as saying 13 soldiers who attempted to enter the presidential palace have been arrested.

03.49 - Hurriyet reports: Soldiers raiding CNN Turk and Hurriyet premises have been arrested.
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marianneh



Joined: 30 May 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:30 am    Post subject: coup Reply with quote

We have to expect the unexpected these days. Last night or early this morning, a British reporter was telling us confidently that Erdogan didn't have the hope of a snowball in Hades. He wouldn't be able to return to the country. His plane would never be allowed to touch down at the airport.

I've just tickled the laptop to get an update, and apparently the coup has been defeated and the military chiefs who supported it are in big trouble. What was the catalyst?

No doubt part of it was connected to further modernisation, secularism and attempts to join the dear old EU. Part of it was to do with jittery feelings about what was happening in Syria.

Ataturk was a ruthless dictator who, if he did not plan the Armenian massacres, did not prevent them either. The sanitised version of the great moderniser, the father of his people is, as the lecturer in American Literature commented, a 'noble lie', told to school kids. It is like a national myth.

I'm not keen on lies, noble or otherwise, but it may have a useful function if it prevents kids seeing Jihadism as the way forward. The latest I've heard is that 161 lives have been lost in the upheavals and there have been many more casualties.

Foreign nationals have been advised to stay indoors. I'm worried about my friend's son. I hope to hear soon that he is ok. But, at best it's a wake up call. He should complete the move to Chile PDQ.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:13 pm    Post subject: Marianne under fire Reply with quote

I haven't the courage to read the very sad details about the children who lost their lives on the promenade in Nice where they went to celebrate liberty and equality with fireworks. It was specifically and not accidentally an act of paedocide.

France has been warned that it will have to live with terrorism and the fear of terrorism for a long time to come. As the country embarks on three days of national mourning, young men are being urged to join the reservists.

But it is quite obvious that having more gendarmes and even soldiers on the streets is not the answer. It didn't stop the Nice attack and it hasn't prevented any other. Perhaps there is no answer.

IS has said that this character, whose first name predictably was Mohammed, was one of their operatives. Whether they are claiming knowledge of him untruthfully in order to increase fear and confusion, God knows.

Although known to the police, he was not on the radar of terrorist monitoring services at all. He is said to have been upset because his wife had left him. As this was in reaction to sustained domestic violence, it would not be appropriate to sympathise with him on this issue or any other.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:42 pm    Post subject: false flag Reply with quote

My partner thinks that the coup in Turkey last night was a false flag operation to give Erdogan an excuse to be more ruthless than ever. I thought, ''Oh no, et tu Brute? You too have fallen for the paranoid world view of Alex Jones, and his ilk?''

I've only heard of two possible false flag operations in history that look remotely feasible. One is America sowing discord in Iran in the 50s. The other is that the Nazis set fire to the Reichstag and blamed it on the Communists. And I'm not aware either has been proved beyond reasonable doubt.

My partner said he had read it in the Independent which is at the top end of the newspaper market. Perhaps it really is true. Erdogan has already said that this is an argument for restoring the death penalty.

Of course he won't get into the EU with behaviour like that. But the EU is not such a popular club as it used to be!
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:46 am    Post subject: inside job? Reply with quote

Maybe it really is a false flag operation! It's not just that it's rather convenient that the 'pro-democracy' revolutionaries bombed parliament, if Erdogan hopes to rule as a dictator without parliament - and it is looking increasingly like the Reichstag fire!

It's often a paranoid and unfair question to ask, 'Cui bono?' for the simple reason that someone will always benefit from an otherwise deplorable event. It's not evidence that they planned it.

But thousands of judges have been arrested, and it must be inferred that their offence is upholding laws that are inconvenient for Erdogan. And that they were all arrested so expeditiously suggests that he had a list prepared.

Well, what do you know? While we were worrying about Theresa May's record on human rights as Home Secretary, this enemy to liberty has taken us by storm. We didn't really see it coming although we knew of his bad reputation.

Although it is an obvious fact, it may be worth spelling out. If Erdogan orchestrated this, and nearly 300 civilians have lost their lives as a result, never mind the private and the high ranking soldiers, he has a cavalier attitude to human life which is not what you really need in a head of state.

People are now predicting that he will be the next Saddam Hussein. I don't know what a sensible response would be, but someone should tell Tony Blair that his intervention is not required![/u]
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Moritz



Joined: 10 Mar 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although it is an obvious fact, it may be worth spelling out. If Erdogan orchestrated this, and nearly 300 civilians have lost their lives as a result, never mind the private and the high ranking soldiers, he has a cavalier attitude to human life which is not what you really need in a head of state.

People are now predicting that he will be the next Saddam Hussein. I don't know what a sensible response would be, but someone should tell Tony Blair that his intervention is not required![/u]




Advent 89, we were in bed, the clock/radio came on "And this is the News: today in Romania ..." and we groaned, yet another massacre. But then "... the Government has abdicated, the Workers have seized Control of the means of Production"

When I first heard of the coup, I was hopeful, Turkey has a Thing for the army seizing power from the priests because the army is the nearest thing they have to a Patriotic arm of the State.

Pope Erdogan killed 300 civilians, that is nothing to the massacres he usually does. How many did he kill at the airport in Constantinople?

I have no objection to a Patriot mayor hanging 300 traitors.
I object to a traitor pope murdering 300 patriots and more.

Pope Erdogan is indeed the new Saddam Hussein. Nato sells him chemical weapons.[/quote]
Quote:

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marianneh



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:49 am    Post subject: uprising Reply with quote

I well remember Advent '89. The previous day, we had heard that demonstrators had put kids at the front of the crowd, thinking the soldiers wouldn't fire on them - but they did of course. As we were lying in bed, the newsreader said, sounding slightly bewildered, ''The Romanian government appears to have been overthrown by the people!''

The joy and surprise were ineffable. These emotions were tempered when it turned out it wasn't over. The soldiers had gone over to supporting the people, but the dictator's secret police were fighting on. It was just unreal when the people took over the state TV station and dragged the dictator's alcoholic son into the studio, crowing, ''Here's the little princeling!'', which we heard in English in the typical 'dubbing voice' which we associated with children's programmes like 'The Boy From Lapland.'

Do you remember praying, ''Please let it be over by Christmas', and then feeling responsible when Dictator and Mrs Dictator were put up against a wall and shot on Christmas Day? It was a betrayal of the revolution as they had been given a show trial that lasted about five minutes.

On the other hand, if they had been shot without a trial on capture and identification, perhaps being given five minutes to say their prayers, I think that could have been justified as a means of preventing further bloodshed.

We can never forget the totalitarian states in Eastern Europe going down like a row of dominos. At the time it looked tremendous. We thought bliss it was in that dawn to be alive.

We didn't know then of the ugly undercurrents that Communism had sat on, which were going to re-emerge. We didn't foresee genocide in Yugoslavia. I've now even heard that Romania had a second round of genocide after the revolution.

We were jubilating and ululating because the Berlin wall was down. An old lady warned us, ''They're all going to become Nazis again!'' I can remember repeating deliriously, ''Oh no they won't, they won't!'' Who was right?

Erdogan had denied that the Armenian genocide ever happened. I can understand that it might be an embarrassing admission for a Turkish person, but he's quite shameless about fitting in a few massacres himself.

His favourite work of fiction is not 'Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone' as you might imagine. It is 'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion'. But he's made the same mistake my son did with the Harry Potter series. My son thought Harry Potter was a real person and that he himself could become a pupil at Hogwarts.

In the same touching way, cute little Erdogan hasn't noticed that 'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion' is fiction yet. Perhaps this will occur to him when he grows up.

He's cracked down on a movement called 'Academics for Freedom' or 'Academics for Human Rights' or some such thing. My friend did get out of the country in time. He saw the writing on the wall as it were. Whether he will get his last month's salary remains to be seen, but at least he's escaped with his life.

You appear to think, Moritz, that whether or not the coup was an inside job, the apparent terrorist attack at Istanbul airport definitely was. Can you expand this theme?


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dai



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Turkey has a lot of meat on it - would you care to start a thread to roast it ?
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:56 am    Post subject: loss Reply with quote

Currently, I'm at a loss as to what's going on, so I'm not ambitious enough to start an independent thread on Turkey yet. I've tried to glean some information from the internet but I'm no wiser.

I can tell you that the Economist magazine has been referring to Turkey as Erdogan's new Sultanate - and this was before the coup. Newspapers say that citizens are celebrating the overthrow of the coup.

According to the Economist, Erdogan has a cult like following in Anatolia which is known as Turkey's 'koran belt.' It looks like these people are ignorant dupes.

Thank goodness our own population is well educated and level headed. We would never fall for the lies of a narcissistic demagogue!
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:11 am    Post subject: police Reply with quote

I've just said I lacked information, but when I next checked the computer, thousands of police officers had been arrested, accused of being involved in the coup.

This is very curious. If all the judges and police officers are in prison, who is doing their usual jobs, and how will they be tried? Will they have to try each other?

John Kerry has warned Erdogan not to go beyond the rule of law in his crackdown. A cleric in exile has been accused of being behind the coup. He indignantly denies it, and says it may have been 'staged.'

This is looking increasingly likely. Maybe it will justify an independent thread for Turkey after all as the juggernaut of oppression crushes the military, the judges, the police and Allah knows whom else.[/u]
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Moritz



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You appear to think, Moritz, that not whether or not the coup was an inside job, the apparent terrorist attack at Istanbul airport definitely was. Can you expand this theme?


ISIL did the bombing. ISIL are allied to Pope Erdogan. Therefore Erdogan wanted the bombing.[/quote]
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:02 pm    Post subject: WTF? Reply with quote

Erdogan is said to have been friendly to Isis and to have funded it. He has denied that Islamic terrorism exists. I don't know how he squared that with the Istanbul airport bombing. He did outwardly condemn it.

Even before the mysterious coup, quite balanced people were talking of the importance of removing him from power while it was still possible. I suppose the chance has been missed.

If only one of us had arrested him while he was in Newport for unilateral talks with Obama! So should we assume he co-ordinated the attack on the airport or just approved of it? This is a very curious situation. It would have been great had there been a successful coup.


Last edited by marianneh on Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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marianneh



Joined: 30 May 2013
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 9:47 pm    Post subject: Another day Reply with quote

The guy who stabbed travellers on a train near Munich had had psychological problems but no previous known connection with Islam. But he shouted, ''Allahu Akbar'' as he lunged with the knife. Perhaps he thought it was the right thing to say, that the etiquette of the situation required it.

As for the German-Iranian who had a shooting rampage in Munich, he saw himself as a hard right anti-immigrant type. The irony is evident.

He must have had some ancestral link with immigrants of Islamic culture. Whether he thought he was opposing or supporting Islamism makes no difference to the victims.

At about the same time, a person who approved of our all adopting a strict Islamic dress code, stabbed a mother and daughter in France because their ensembles didn't leave enough to the imagination.

You might think it was no business of his how they were dressed. But he would disagree with you. He probably thought he was 'demanding right and forbidding wrong', a cultural trope that may have originated in Classical Greece but is now often heard in the House of Islam.

The attacks in France have partly been 'revenge' for banning the burqa. They have mostly been aimed at secular and republican targets as with the disgusting events of Bastille Day.

France is now one of the most secularised states in the world. But, of course, it does have a history as 'the eldest daughter of the Roman Catholic Church.'

I was not surprised at the terrorist attack in France today. As a tabloid paper said, it's getting to the stage of 'another day, another terrorist attack, same old same old.'

But I was surprised at the venue, a Catholic church in Rouen that looks as it it dates from the ancien regime, the priest forced to his knees - and was he beheaded? the nun who escaped and the other nun who was shot. Pope Francis condemned the 'barbarous' act.

That was not what he said at time of the Charlie Hebdo massacre. He effectively said the editorial staff were asking for it.

Although Isis and Al Qaeda were contemplating a real physical attack on the Vatican itself a few years ago, it did not then occur to the Pontiff to wonder if we were all in it together. He will have to decide which side he is on.
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marianneh



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:23 pm    Post subject: fax Reply with quote

Today I went to the library to meet a friend who was going to rehearse with me our part in the Eisteddfod. I also had with me the letter resigning as a lecturer at Istanbul University to fax for another friend.

I was anxious to get it done before he could change his mind. He had been speaking of going back to Turkey to demand his last month's salary. Those who feel less emotional about his salary than he does, thought that would be a disastrous mistake.

Was he going to take his senior colleagues to the small claims court? How would that work when the judges are in prison? The librarian told me that she couldn't send the fax. The machine had a problem.

My friend came and we rehearsed our recitation with the true Eisteddfod cadences while her husband filmed us and her son advised on the Breton inspired music.

I then rushed off to the One Stop Shop. After an interminable wait, the person told me it was not possible to send the fax. I was now afraid the technical error was at the Turkish end.

Were all the phone lines down in Istanbul? Had they been cut?

I tried a secretarial services office. They had no fax machine, and doubted I would be able to send a fax from anywhere in Abergavenny.

I feared it would not be possible anywhere in the world. Where else could I try? Pluto?

Finally I threw myself on the mercy of a solicitor's office. Fearing I would have to pay through the nose, I explained how important it was and that I had a budget of five pounds. At the second attempt, it was accepted.

I babbled my thanks and relief. If my friend went back to Turkey, as a senior professor - although actually in his 30s - he wouldn't get any back pay. He would be thrown into one of Erdogan's dungeons.

The academic world has been purged. 'Purge' is not quite the right word as it implies that a few of them might be untouched.

According to reliable sources, Erdogan is suspicious of dangerous intellectuals. They are all in prison being tortured, raped and murdered. Are we going to take this lying down?


Last edited by marianneh on Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dai



Joined: 09 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just catching up on this thread and I would like to remark how both your own and Moritz's remarks have made me smile and think ... I might inquire as to whether the scope of this thread extends also to the criminal acts of others committed by homicidal egotists professing other belief systems - religious, political, scientific etc - even artistic perhaps ?

Apart from David Hockney, has anybody ever committed atrocities in the name of art ? One that comes to mind in a minor way was that guy arrested for stapling live budgerigars to the walls of a civic art gallery - I think that he argued that he had not pierced any living tissue but only the feathers which are dead tissue ... Come to think of it The Easter Rising was a sort of performance art - it was laced with cultural references ... and looking back self-immolation might well qualify e.g. when X's father decided to imitate that Buddhist monk and set fire to himself in the 1960s - likewise this rash of imitators inspired by ISIS but probably having no more contact with them other than by watching tv.
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